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▲ brookst 4 hours ago

Anthropic is not in the model business. They were smart and they are building productivity ecosystem business. Look at what claude artifacts are doing now -- inline multi-user editing, comments that users and/or models can respond and take action on, import/export from all common formats. It's at least a Google Docs killer if not an M365 killer.

And claude code as a harness and skill/plugin/mcp ecosystem is far more valuable than any one model.

And coward for long-running tasks, though they're slipping on that one because they're really trying hard not to make Claude an assistant. We'll see if they react to Muse and change course.

But the Chinese free-weight models? Not a competitor. If/when those companies (or others) build vertically integrated productivity stacks on those free models, then we'll talk. Microsoft certainly saw that opportunity but couldn't get out of their own way and are basically roadkill at this point.

▲njovin 4 hours ago | parent | next [-]

I have a hard time believing that making “a really good harness” justifies pre-ordering half the world’s GPU compute for years in advance.

▲jacquesm 3 hours ago | parent | next [-]

It doesn't. But it did stop a lot of other projects in their tracks because the hardware cost suddenly more than doubled.

▲brookst 33 minutes ago | parent | prev [-]

Did you really read me whole comment and come way with "a really good harness"?

▲OtherShrezzing 3 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

>Anthropic is not in the model business. They were smart and they are building productivity ecosystem business... It's at least a Google Docs killer if not an M365 killer.

Google Workspace revenues are something like $25bn/q, and that's the entire workspace division, (including enterprise gmail sales, so the productivity suite is meaningfully smaller than that figure). It's taken Google a long time to carve that slice out of Microsoft's entrenched market position. It's not small money, but they'd basically be going to war with two of the largest and most profitable companies in history on their turf.

I don't think they can credibly take that business plan to the market and say it'll be worth $1.75tn. They're all-or-nothing on being in the model business, and everything else is superfluous.

▲brookst 28 minutes ago | parent [-]

What do you think Google Workspace would sell for, if Google divested?

$100B/year in revenue; SaaS so call it 70% gross margin, 30% net, NPV is about $500B.

Not enough if you think that's the only revenue Anthropic could every have. But even if they only peel off $100B NPV, it's incremental to an IPO valuation.

▲redanddead 4 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

>claude code

The same one that leaked itself a few months ago?

▲brookst 33 minutes ago | parent [-]

The same way a source code leak of M365 would totally wipe out its revenue?

▲redanddead 28 minutes ago | parent [-]

M365 is a terrible example

▲brookst 27 minutes ago | parent [-]

Hard to argue with that level of depth

▲redanddead 24 minutes ago | parent [-]

Not everything needs to be an argument, and regardless you didn't change my mind

The value is in the harness! The harness leaked itself

▲stefan_ 4 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

I mean, a lot of people before them were "not in the model business" (Cursor et al) and it seems they got disintermediated by the model companies. Step 1 is still to have the best model, or hope for model progress to taper out.

▲brookst 31 minutes ago | parent | next [-]

Vertical integration is hugely valuable, but revenue comes from the top of the stack, not the bottom.

Apple makes great margins on hardware. They are 100% not in the CNC milling business. But their investments at that low level and vertical integration allow for higher margins at the top.

Cursor had... nothing. A minor, indefensible value add to a much larger and wealthier supplier.

▲jacquesm 4 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

> or hope for model progress to taper out

No, that would kill them for sure. Or did you mean 'open model progress'?