The petition to withdraw and amend the bill was presented to the House of Commons today [1]. People whining about how there's nothing they can do basically don't engage in democracy and thats how you end up in a US situation..

[1] https://www.ourcommons.ca/petitions/en/Petition/Details?Peti...

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kareemm 3 hours ago | parent | next [-]

I emailed 9 senators and heard back from one. Emailed the other 8 today. Even when you engage, there's little positive feedback. The older I get, the more I believe this is a feature of the system and not a bug.

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JumpCrisscross 2 hours ago | parent | next [-]

> emailed 9 senators and heard back from one

Good start. Calls are also excellent. Then get your neighbors to do the same.

For controversial stuff, you want tens to hundreds of outreach events recorded. It doesn’t take all that much for electeds to spell a festering primary threat.

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8note an hour ago | parent | next [-]

electeds? primary threat? i think that might backfire in the canadian senate

i know i voted against the referendum question last week to consider moving to a US inspired elected senate system. i dont think we need that pageantry

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JumpCrisscross an hour ago | parent | next [-]

> electeds? primary threat?

I'm familiar with American and Swiss elections. In both, the principal threat to an incumbent is from an own-party challenger to their seat.

For an incumbent, particularly one in a comfortable seat, an opposition candidate is usually not an issue. But someone from inside the camp is annoying and requires rhetorical contorting and lots of spending, spending that can then leave one vulnerable to an otherwise-benign opposition candidate. (Also, motivated activists are annoying in the best way.)

A smart elected–in these systems–will thus take a call to defuse anger before it develops into organized activism.

	▲	munk-a an hour ago \| parent [-]
		Ah, to clarify, Canada's upper house is basically a house of lords equivalent that we expect to be full of puffed up nobodies that get paid a too generous stipend to sit there and keep their mouths shut. Canada has one elected congress body (the one we all talk about) and then this vestigial senate which is generally expected to sit there and silently approve everything that passes through it. It does technically have power, but it's like the King's power to veto UK legislation - he can do it precisely once and then he'll be stripped of the power.

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munk-a an hour ago | parent | prev [-]

Yeah, I think it'd be excellent if we could just disband our upper house and while it's worth pushing them to act on this bill I loathe the senate's continued existence and would rather be in a position where this emergency call happened prior to it passing the house.

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buckle8017 43 minutes ago | parent | prev [-]

There are no primaries in Canada at all.

Parties select their representatives who run in the election.

The system basically guarantees that insiders cannot be removed.

	▲	seanw444 30 minutes ago \| parent [-]
		That actually sounds crazy to me. At least for the House of Commons. I'm amenable to upper chambers of bicameral legislatures being indirectly elected. That's how the US Senate used to be before the constitution was amended.

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NoahZuniga 2 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

You won't be able to convince representatives with facts and logic. So many people want their attention that they can't pay enough attention to your arguments to be convinced. Contacting them is about showing that you care about it.

If they receive 100 calls of people saying they're strongly against a bill and no for they might reconsider their position.

Also calling is a better signal of showing you care then emailing.

	▲	trollbridge an hour ago \| parent [-]
		Why not both?

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neom 3 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

Colin Deacon seems to care: https://www.linkedin.com/feed/update/urn:li:activity:7519403...

Paula Simons has also been actively listening to Canadians on this subject. https://sencanada.ca/en/senators/simons-paula/

	▲	EmbarrassedHelp 2 hours ago \| parent [-]
		Paula Simons is almost certainly against Bill C-22, so it probably won't be of any use to contact her about rejecting it. I would focus efforts on other Senators.

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lstodd 3 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

Haha. You don't email them, you cut off their funding and smear their public image. This is how you make them move, not with emails. It takes some work though.

	▲	pixl97 3 hours ago \| parent \| next [-]
		Careful there, too much of this kind of thinking and the MPs are going to find child porn on your phone, you sick criminal thief trying to overthrow the government.
	▲	rightnutwingjob 2 hours ago \| parent \| prev [-]
		Where’s the cut-of-their-funding lever? Dial #lever and say “cut off”.

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zetanor 3 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

I do not believe that a majority of humans can be made to meaningfully engage with democracy. If this is true and POSIWID, then mass democracy only ever nullifies any real extent of democracy. As I see it, the only real solution is to replace power. I don't know how to do that. Do you?

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JumpCrisscross 2 hours ago | parent | next [-]

> do not believe that a majority of humans can be made to meaningfully engage with democracy

They don’t need to. When the informed minority on an issue gets lazy, stupid or cynical, however, the system dies.

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Nifty3929 2 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

This is why it's so important to have guardrails that limit what the government can do. The US tried to do that, and has probably been the most successful at it - though there's still been a lot of scope creep outside their constitution already. And that's probably a one-way street.

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aetherspawn 2 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

Voting for every little thing is compulsory in Australia and it’s honestly really annoying.

	▲	EmbarrassedHelp an hour ago \| parent [-]
		It also hasn't stopped Australia's descent into tech authoritarianism either.

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tensor 3 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

Indeed. I've also sent several emails to my MP. Sadly I've received no response. :-/

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brailsafe 3 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

Hmm that's odd, it was presented by my MP but wasn't aware of a chance to sign it

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loufe 3 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

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