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▲ Rudybega 9 hours ago

If the average human in twenty years isn't far more cognitively capable than the average human now, I'll eat my hat (assuming of course, we don't all die).

Between biology advances remediating disabilities, customized outcome-driven education, potential advances in drugs that regulate executive function/memory/etc., improvements in nutrition, improvements in access, reductions in stress, I think we'll see people flourish.

And that's completely ignoring the more out there biological/computer merger style Sci-Fi outcomes, which I believe have a non-zero chance of occurring.

▲ungovernableCat 8 hours ago | parent | next [-]

I'll be the negative nancy and say that I think it's more likely we see an acceleration of the current trend. If we're talking about students, the top students will be doing as well or better than today but the median might see a big regression.

I have friends who work in primary education and they say there's definitely been some sort of decline in cognitive skills. A lot more kids struggle with holding attention and thinking outside of the box.

I think too much screen exposure has been terrible for the average child.

▲Rudybega 8 hours ago | parent | next [-]

I definitely don't disagree with screen or exposure or social media exposure being deleterious.

That said, I suspect this technology will allow us to study and mitigate those effects in ways we weren't previously capable of. That's in addition to the other broad swathe of things that should make us healthier and more intelligent (see some of my other posts here). I'm not particularly negative about our chances.

▲ungovernableCat 8 hours ago | parent | next [-]

I do hope for an optimistic outcome of course. But the same cohort that gave us algorithmic screen maximisation is also funding and leading the AI revolution so I'm a bit sceptical they have our best interest in mind.

▲fcarraldo 8 hours ago | parent [-]

Not only are they leading the AI revolution, but consumer AI app design follows the same principles as the screen-time-maximization apps.

Skinner box design, pull a lever and get an answer (or an app, or a song, or a poem, or a research paper).

A common complaint amongst colleagues is that they aren't able to stop "checking on their agents" after hours. This stuff is just as addictive as the rest of the consumer apps eating up all of our time and attention.

▲ 7 hours ago | parent | prev [-]
[deleted]
▲jdprgm 6 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

If the top students are doing better, especially if it is significantly better, I think that can be a net positive outcome. If you look at the distribution of contribution to society it's not like it's remotely even and there is an argument to primarily focusing on and pouring most of our resources into the top Nth percent instead of trying to slightly improve everyone.

▲Glyptodon an hour ago | parent | prev | next [-]

There's something going wrong in the US at least with elementary age kids that makes me pretty dubious about this unless your expectation is that everything splits into an underclass and an over class with the underclass eventually being replaced by robots and AI before dying out or something. And I really hope that's not what you mean.

▲epihelix 2 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

Advances made by a few with LLM assistance does not imply an increase in cognitive ability at the population level.

▲flir 8 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

Is it worth mentioning that the Flynn Effect seems to have been running backwards lately?

(The drug thing, maybe you've got a point. But in just 20 years?)

▲Rudybega 8 hours ago | parent [-]

> But in just 20 years?

Ahh, I think this bit on my part may need some elaboration. Here's my main underlying belief:

We are systematizing biology and turning it into a computationally tractable domain. I think we're going to make more gains in our understanding of it in the next 20 years than we have in the entirety of human existence prior to this moment (that's mainly because our understanding until now has been remarkably poor).

▲flir 8 hours ago | parent [-]

I'm thinking about that plus time-to-market which would be what, a decade?

▲Rudybega 8 hours ago | parent [-]

If we make the kind of understanding gains that I'm positing (think actual accurate simulations of various biological systems), that cycle tightens dramatically.

▲ChrisLTD 7 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

Silicon Valley tech, including LLM based AI, is extraordinary at manipulating the digital world. I don’t think we have the evidence that it can cross into and manipulate the physical world in the same way.

▲oblio 8 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

> If the average human in twenty years isn't far more cognitively capable than the average human now, I'll eat my hat (assuming of course, we don't all die).

You do know that educational results based on the best evaluation we've created so far, PISA, have been dropping since 2015, roughly when smartphones and social media became widespread?

What makes you believe that LLMs from more or less the same companies will be any different?

▲Aerroon 5 hours ago | parent | next [-]

The average score peaked in 2009 though.

https://www.oecd.org/en/data/dashboards/pisa-education-and-s...

Ie it's been dropping since 2009.

For mathematics and reading the large drop off is between 2018 and 2022.

▲Apollorider 8 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

[dead]

▲Rudybega 8 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

Peptide style drugs already have clear positive effects on executive function, it's not particularly hard to envision that we'll find other classes of drugs that have similar effects in other cognitive domains. Twenty years is a long time, and we're set up to make absurd gains in our understanding of biology over that time frame. If we additionally are able to mitigate or cure various intellectual disabilities, that's a massive baseline performance boost to the population as well.

If you want some examples in how AI could improve education:

* Alpha School (https://alpha.school/the-program/) reports 2.6× faster learning growth with just 2 hours of AI-driven instruction daily, with students scoring in the 99th percentile nationally.

* Mindspark (https://www.povertyactionlab.org/evaluation/scaling-personal...), deployed in Indian schools, demonstrated gains of +0.22 SD in math and +0.20 SD in language in a randomized trial involving 6,500 students.

* A Harvard study (https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC12179260/) found more than 2× the median learning gains using AI tutors.

The broader implications are clear: individualized, adaptive tutoring at scale is becoming accessible in ways that historically required expensive one-on-one instruction. This is also going to be possible in places that historically never had access to this quality of instruction, which again, is a massive boost to the human baseline.

I don't think the future looks like Wall-E. I think it looks like insanely healthy people able to pursue their passions with a level of rigour and capability that has never existed before.

Edit: fucked up link 2, fixed

▲fcarraldo 8 hours ago | parent | next [-]

are you seriously suggesting that the cure to the education crisis is peptides?

for children?

▲Rudybega 8 hours ago | parent [-]

Yeah man, that's a good faith interpretation of what I said! You've owned me and scored points, good job!

▲fcarraldo 8 hours ago | parent [-]

high five

do you want to expand on what you meant? the rest of your post is fine, but the opening sentence seems to suggest the cure to smartphones and AI having significant negative impacts on critical educational development is giving all kids pharmaceuticals.

▲Rudybega 7 hours ago | parent [-]

Imagine a drug that cures Alzheimer's. Does that improve the baseline cognitive level of the population? What about if we manage to find a cure for various intellectual disabilities (Down's, Fragile X, FAS, etc.). Does that improve the baseline cognitive level of the population? What if we mitigate some of the worst effects of aging on a population wide scale?

What if we achieve an understanding of how memories form in the brain and what factors distinguish individuals who have eidetic or near eidetic memory and can synthesize drugs or treatments that replicate that? What if we can find similar distinguishing factors for other cognitive domains (perception, visual spatial skills, etc.) and find drugs or treatments that improve those capabilities?

> but the opening sentence seems to suggest the cure to smartphones and AI having significant negative impacts on critical educational development is giving all kids pharmaceuticals.

You have to be operating extremely cynically for that to be your default interpretation of what I said, but go off.

▲fcarraldo 5 hours ago | parent [-]

I don't think I'm operating extremely cynically, but I think you may be misinterpreting what this thread is about. The GP above the comment that I initially replied to referenced the PISA result scores[0] put out in a report by the OECD.

Their report indicates that since 2015, there has been a massive drop in scores for reading and mathematics performance. This is a reversal of a longstanding trend - performance had been consistently improving, then it plateaued, and now it is consistently dropping[1].

The problem is that _normal kids_ aren't learning anymore, not that the cognitive baseline of the population is statistically changing.

[0] https://www.oecd.org/en/about/news/press-releases/2026/09/pi... [1] https://www.oecd.org/en/data/dashboards/pisa-education-and-s...

▲jonahx 8 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

We seriously looked into Alpha School, my impression was strongly "overpriced con". Frankly, I don't believe their marketing material, which is what you're quoting. I am not anti-AI in learning (LLMs have a great learning boost for me personally), but learning especially for children is a complex problem and truly making it more efficient will take more innovation than an ipad with a magic program. I would caution more skepticism with these results, especially self-reported ones.

▲Rudybega 7 hours ago | parent [-]

I mean, that's entirely possible. It's definitely less powerful evidence than the other two. The Mindspark RCT in particular seems pretty sound (6500 participants, statistically significant improved outcomes).

▲ 8 hours ago | parent | prev [-]
[deleted]
▲freecodeio 9 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

[flagged]

▲Rudybega 9 hours ago | parent [-]

What high quality engagement on your part. Clearly you're the mature party here.

I'm 35 and have worked in ML generally for a decade and NLP for six years. Any other questions about my bonafides?

▲copperx 9 hours ago | parent | next [-]

Trust is low. Send 2-Nonenal test results.

▲batty_alex 9 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

[flagged]

▲Rudybega 8 hours ago | parent | next [-]

I'm not entirely sure what your hostility is founded in or why you think it's appropriate for a forum that's supposed to promote the direct engagement of ideas.

What aspect of my comment, specifically, do you think should embarrass me? Address the content, not the person.

Do you think we're not going to make any advances in medicine that promote a higher baseline level of cognitive function? Do you think society will entirely lose interest in educating its citizenry and will completely forgo using these tools to improve education? What's your core contention here?

▲monkey_monkey 8 hours ago | parent [-]

I'm not as completely optimistic as you seem to be about the future of humanity with AI (I think it will probably be a huge benefit, but with immense disruption and a non-zero chance of a Skynet-like event), but I didn't see anything embarrassing about your comment at all.

▲stuartjohnson12 8 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

Aloof condescension and snark is the embarrassing thing to be doing on HN.

▲whattheheckheck 8 hours ago | parent [-]

Yeah like are we all supposed to guess at what the quiet wise elders are saying or can they grow some balls and be loud leaders. Idiot bullies are getting to be in charge

▲JoeAltmaier 8 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

Folks back in the early 1900s had from 10 to 30 points less IQ than today, as old renomalized test results reveal. Ellis Island even had an admissions test, and they rejected a significant number of people.

https://iq-exams.com/blog/flynn-effect-explained