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▲ nomilk 5 hours ago

> remind ordinary Russians

Ordinary Russians think the war's bad too. Only difference is you and I can say that without getting 15 years in a (very harsh) prison.

▲kpil 4 hours ago | parent | next [-]

I'm not totally sure about that.

Maybe Russians outside Russia.

Of course almost everyone thinks war is bad, but many seem to think it's justified - different thing.

There seem to be a wide support for the idea that Russia is threatened (economically and to an extent military) by the global West, and also that Ukraine is not entitled to be independent and also many of the official lies about the background.

Good lies have a nugget of truth in them, and this is the case also here.

Russia's economy is not growing (compared to EU, US), fertility rate is down, the revolution in Ukraine undermines the stability of the Russian regime, the attempted coup in Belarus was also a threat, NATO is arguably expanding - lately as a reaction to the war but nonetheless, EU is expanding into post-Soviet states both offering membership but also trade agreements which undercut Russia's ambition to be an economical hub in the region, etc.

▲xtracto 31 minutes ago | parent | next [-]

It's like Americans thinking thar what their president is doing is right. Nobody in there is doing anything to stop it.

▲nomilk 3 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

Often, both are true. It's perfectly legitimate for anyone (Russian or otherwise) to have geo-political concerns (e.g. NATO expansion, Cuban missile crisis etc), but a Russian concerned about NATO expansion may also be very opposed to the extreme option of war as a solution.

War affects an ordinary Russian in very negative ways: the possibility of conscription (w/ risk of injury/death), complications for travel, sanctions on goods and services, and the economic opportunity cost (money wasted on war that could have gone to productive uses, plus reduced economic output due to drone strikes on yandex, wildberries, refineries).

▲killerstorm 3 hours ago | parent [-]

Russia could fully integrate into EU/NATO if it really wanted.

That's just not compatible with ambitions of its corrupt leaders who want to be a root-level player, not "one of NATO countries". And I'm not sure how legitimate is prioritization of wants of corrupt leaders over well-being of your compatriots.

▲jacquesm an hour ago | parent | next [-]

Unsurprisingly, the same motivates the current crop of leadership in the US. They stopped teaching history in school I guess.

▲RuslanL 24 minutes ago | parent | prev [-]

They have asked to be a part of nato twice around 2000th and were both times rejected.

▲killerstorm 9 minutes ago | parent [-]

NATO is not something you can just apply to on a whim. The path for a membership was there: e.g. there were some joint exercises, etc. Obviously they also need political integration as well.

Russia actually have been a member of Council of Europe (PACE, etc.) since 1996 but it was expelled in 2022. If they had a good record in Council of Europe they could really go for NATO membership eventually.

▲formvoltron an hour ago | parent | prev [-]

imagine if Putin had said... we are slipping behind the west. They are threatening us. So... we'll double down on research & education. We'll outthink them. We'll shift our economy into an economy that thrives in the future.

▲SEJeff 25 minutes ago | parent [-]

Pretty much precisely what the US did during the Cold War. To do so, we had to outspend the Soviets, and by a LOT. But the world buying US treasury bonds was basically a credit card for us to finance the above things that result into the world’s strongest military.

▲killerstorm 3 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

Ordinary Russians think "yeah war sucks, I wish Ukraine surrenders so peace can be restored". I'm afraid only a tiny minority believes Russia needs to surrender.

▲Lio 2 hours ago | parent | next [-]

It’s worth pointing out that Russia doesn’t need to “surrender” to stop the war. It just needs to withdraw.

That’s not surrender because Russia started this invasion without provocation. It wasn’t under attack and Ukraine hadn’t joined NATO.

Russia had no reason to invade except as a show of force.

If Putin suddenly declared he’d met his objectives and withdrew who’s to say otherwise?

▲conmod278 2 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

When the pager attack happened, there was a implicity sentiment on focusing on the technical details and not focus on politics. But I didn't see the same sentiment when Iran ballistic missles did their job.

▲preisschild 2 hours ago | parent [-]

Irans BMs primarily targeted cities, the pager attacks resulted in a lot less civilian casualties

▲brabel 2 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

Does anyone really believe Russia will eventually just surrender and leave? I can’t imagine the rationale to believe that. When Putin leaves all indications are that the next leader will actually be much more hawkish. They will only leave if someone bombs them to death. Which is quite a dangerous thing to do. Ukraine is pushing the limits, and everyone knows it’s with the help of many EU countries. I wonder what it will take for Russia to reach desperate measures in this war.

▲simondotau 2 hours ago | parent | next [-]

Russia have been taking desperate measures for years. The only thing they haven’t done is use nukes, which Russia can’t use without consequences that vastly outweigh the benefits.

▲kolinko 2 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

They left Afghanistan. Also, Imdon’t see Ukraine giving up any time soon either.

▲killerstorm 2 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

I see no reason why they can't agree on a truce: Russia haven't gained any meaningful ground for a while. A truce or even a peace treaty would be strictly beneficial to Russia.

▲ivan_gammel an hour ago | parent [-]

Any outcome short of surrender of Ukraine is an enormous headache for Putin that will likely cost him and his system dearly. They simply cannot, or they will be dead. Why? Because a million of veterans coming back and telling the stories will ask this question: „Why?“ The „Nazis“ are still in Kiev, the NATO is coming, what we got is just thousands of kilometers of ruins, what for was that? The war keeps them busy, for now. The situation is worse for Ukraine than for Russia, so it may feel like they can go on and actually win.

The same can be actually said about Zelensky, for whom any concessions to Russia mean political death too. If Ukraine loses territories forever, people will ask, why so many had to die for that. What was the plan. And blaming the West (which won‘t be 100% justified) will not help. And he may feel that now he is applying good pressure too, with those drone strikes and knocked out refineries.

▲bamboozled 3 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

For the time being.

▲rcMgD2BwE72F 4 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

Are they physically forced to vote for Putin? And how widespread is the electoral fraud?

▲stratos123 2 minutes ago | parent | next [-]

Before the latest Russian election one of the parties opposed the war in Ukraine and was a bit too popular, so, well, from https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yabloko :

  Yabloko is the sole officially registered party to openly oppose the Russian war in Ukraine, openly calling "for peace and freedom". The party planned to partake in the 2026 Russian legislative election under their anti-war slogan.[29][30] However, in August 2026, the party was barred from running by the Supreme Court of Russia due to a lawsuit by Rodina.
Also, several politicians associated with it were imprisoned, e.g. this guy: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lev_Shlosberg
▲RuslanL 15 minutes ago | parent | prev | next [-]

Well, some decades ago if you were a school teacher, you were _asked_ to (1) vote "right" yourself (2) call all parents and ask them to vote "right". If you disobeyed, the school got problems and you got problems. Maybe not enough to make all people comply, but sufficient to get the right outcomes. Same goes for all government-funded workers.

Since then I think they simplified the system and just forge the results outright.

▲nomilk 4 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

This is informative https://politics.stackexchange.com/a/27658/25206

tl;dr Other parties are Putin-like, and if/when a genuine alternative emerges, Putin deals with them ruthlessly. Example: Navalny was the charismatic leader of a small but popular rival party with anti-corruption policies. He was initially delegitimised (not allowed to partake in the 2018 elections due to [likely fake] charges of embezzlement), then poisoned (nearly died), then imprisoned, and then killed while in prison.

Consider the terrifying message that sends to would-be political rivals...