Wages are always too low if you replace Americans with cheaper foreigners.

you cant build career out of seasonal job in some random resort places across the country.

the idea is that foreigners will do the temp/seasonal low value work, while Americans were supposed to educate and upskill using federal student loans and get a high value jobs.

unfortunately American education system made it impossible, ue to stupidity.

Only China is able to do that: massively educate population and upskill and go up the value chain of manufacturing and industrialization.

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supertrope 5 minutes ago | parent | next [-]

So learn to code?

	▲	bijowo1676 a few seconds ago \| parent [-]
		Learn anything at very deep and competitive level, instead of paying some random bootcamp to sit throught the $10 Udemy course and $20 Coursera certificate on how to write hello world

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lumost an hour ago | parent | prev | next [-]

I think this up-skilling sentiment misses that as a worker who thought a seasonal service job on the waterfront was a good deal, up-skilling means taking on 6 figures in debt - after which they will only have a ~1/5 chance of getting a job which compensates for the opportunity cost and debt. For many, this is actually a bad deal and growing their own seasonal business would have been a stronger career path.

	▲	bijowo1676 an hour ago \| parent [-]
		if you are opening your own seasonal business, then you WANT seasonal wages suppressed. You dont want wages to go up, as this will be your cost of doing business. Any american bitchin about low wages and competition was supposed to set up own S-Corp/LLC and hire his "competitors" and take advantage of those "low wages" You have unrestricted work authorization, you have SBA loans and everything possible to create your own American Dream(R)

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smallmancontrov an hour ago | parent | prev | next [-]

> impossible, ue to stupidity.

Due to the jobs not existing in the number required.

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bijowo1676 an hour ago | parent [-]

tech jobs are abundant but talent is not there, hence the need for h1b and such

same for microchip manufacturing (Micron and TSMC factories in US) and every other high value industry.

heck even Submarine production cannot find welders and machinists.

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whstl an hour ago | parent [-]

Just wanna say: thanks for going the opposite way of the other half of this website who's just constantly saying tech jobs are gone.

It's still incredibly hard to hire skilled devs.

	▲	smallmancontrov 43 minutes ago \| parent \| next [-]
		> other half More than half. Everyone is talking their book here, and the book that isn't blind to this problem belongs to the overwhelming majority.
	▲	bijowo1676 an hour ago \| parent \| prev [-]
		I absolutely understand both sides, and the sentiment of some Americans who feel betrayed by their government when they see foreigners coming in, getting elite Ivy League degrees, and snatching six-seven figure jobs. The resentment is absolutely understandable. What I am trying to explain is that, if magically, all foreigners are expelled, H1B/OPT banned, all Indian visas canceled, this will NEVER result in Americans getting more jobs. Quite the opposite. Global Capability Centers already are offshoring everything possible outside the US, just because of trump rhetoric. American capitalist is not stupid, the billionaires are not idiots. Why should they hire and overpay for unskilled Americans just because they happen to be born here, instead of hiring the most qualified person? Any anti-immigrant legislation will simply accelerate the offshoring, or even worse, will create competing tech giants outside the US. It is this entitlement attitude is whats going to ruin the US tech sector and scare the talent away.

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linuxftw an hour ago | parent | prev [-]

It doesn't matter if someone can build a career out of seasonal jobs, which is entirely false btw. The market will dictate how much seasonal goods and services are worth, thus setting wages and property values.

Just like farm labor: without importing foreigners, legal or otherwise, wages would go up, food prices would go up, prices, wages, and property values would normalize to market rates.

	▲	bijowo1676 an hour ago \| parent [-]
		your libertarian view of economy is too naiive. There is no "free market" in the US. Everything that impacts inflation/CPI is tightly controlled by the federal government with monetary tools like credit expansion, rates, federal incentives and such. the reason why America wants to suppress low value jobs, is because they are input to the actual output of American economy: agriculture, high value industrial goods, tech services, financial services, real estate, financial asset s and services. These are the actual components of US GDP and American government does everything possible to keep the input to these sectors stable/low, in order to protect the profits of these industries. Do you see how wages seasonal workers are lower priority to the profits of Vail Corporation?