What's the argument here? An airplane, a bee and a bird all fly despite doing it totally differently. LLMs also reason despite being made out of matmuls instead of meat.

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JoshTriplett 7 hours ago | parent | next [-]

> What's the argument here?

The most common argument for this is some core unexamined axiom that only humans can reason by definition, and then working backwards to a justification for that.

	▲	antonvs 4 hours ago \| parent [-]
		Not only unexamined, but ineffable. I've yet to see anyone give a good definition of what they think "reasoning" is that applies to humans solving complex logical problems but not to machines. (I suppose a religious or otherwise superstitious person might introduce the soul into this, but I haven't come across anyone actually willing to defend that hill.)

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zahlman 6 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

This is just a trick of language. There's no rule that says a priori whether an English word created before the invention of machines mimicking the behaviour, should describe the mimicry. There's no contradiction between "an airplane can 'fly'" and "a computer cannot 'reason'" because there is no reason why the two claims should relate whatsoever.

	▲	chpatrick 5 hours ago \| parent \| next [-]
		Well, but we do we have these words, and they are useful. An airplane and a bird both travel through the air. A human and an LLM both make logical deductions.
	▲	antonvs 4 hours ago \| parent \| prev [-]
		You can just look at the definitions and see whether they apply. The relevant MW definition for "reasoning" is: "the use of reason, especially: the drawing of inferences or conclusions through the use of reason." And "reason" is: "the power of comprehending, inferring, or thinking especially in orderly rational ways." Functionally speaking, i.e. in terms of observable behavior, LLMs exhibit comprehension, inferring, and reasoning. If someone wants to object to that, they'd need to explain what relevant property prevents a conclusion drawn by an LLM from being counted as involving reasoning.