I'm not making a point on whether they do or not, but on the premise that absence of evidence is evidence of absence... But I've been alive for serious debates on:

1. Lobsters don't feel pain - dunk them in boiling water alive.

2. Babies don't feel pain - mutilate their genitals without anesthesia.

3. Black people don't feel pain "the same way" (and are just after drugs).

4. Women feel too much pain (and it should be ignored).

So maybe let's take a moment to think what criteria we're going to use to make these claims. And the potential harm of the decision.

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frumplestlatz 11 hours ago | parent [-]

Maybe consider the obvious, enormous chasm between everything you just listed and an LLM.

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Tadpole9181 11 hours ago | parent [-]

Oh, yeah, of course. None of those other people said the same thing about the obvious, enormous chasm between "real" people and everything else listed. I'm glad you're taking even a single moment to reflect on the idea.

	▲	frumplestlatz 11 hours ago \| parent [-]
		Everything you listed is a biological entity with a common evolutionary heritage. All but one of the things that you listed is just a human being. Tell me, where is the pain center in a GPU? Where are the nerves? Persistent memory? Any evolutionary reason at all to develop a pain response that in any way mimics ours? Model weights are not a gestalt biological entity. The things that you listed are not in any way remotely similar to a model. I would suggest you plug your comment into a model and ask it to critique it — it might help you walk through why your comparison makes absolutely no sense whatsoever. One nice thing about models is that they they don’t get annoyed explaining the obvious, because they’re not conscious entities.