From a business perspective a frontier model does not make much sense anymore if you are not a startup. Neither for Amazon, nor for Google. Their clouds need models that are fast and perform well in their agent frameworks nothing were a frontier model excels at.

Most Google products even use flash lite underneath, so their frontier model is mostly used for distillation.

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aleph_minus_one an hour ago | parent [-]

> From a business perspective a frontier model does not make much sense anymore if you are not a startup. Neither for Amazon, nor for Google. Their clouds need models that are fast and perform well in their agent frameworks nothing w[h]ere a frontier model excels at.

A good consideration; just one point from my side: as far as I am aware (but I may be wrong), Gemini is not known to perform well in an agentic framework.

This is no contradiction to your other claims, quite the opposite: perhaps (or even likely) Google wants to avoid that their models become a commodity in some (agentic?) application where the middleman who actually writes this application gets a disproportionate of the money that the customer of the application pays for it.

	▲	merb 6 minutes ago \| parent \| next [-]
		Well at the moment we do not use Gemini in an agentic framework. But as said the flash and flash lite families are basically their driving force in some of their applications in Google cloud, like document ai and its ocr capabilities are probably better when it comes to business documents than any other (at least in perf to cost to speed). We also drive Gemini lite in our application where customer can use it to generate simple automation, like an agentic framework but way way smaller scale. And while it struggles in more context heavy operations it still is a beast when feeding it one or two pdf documents and asking questions about them and it’s hella fast.
	▲	nozzlegear an hour ago \| parent \| prev [-]
		> A good consideration; just one point from my side: as far as I am aware (but I may be wrong), Gemini is not known to perform well in an agentic framework. I used it for a month over the summer, right before they were going through the migration to antigravity. It was a fine workhorse IMO, no complaints from me.