Of course it works and is beautiful hardware and all that.

But don't fool yourself. You're subverted to Apple's rules the same as Microsoft users are to Windows.

I prefer to fight a little bit on an update on a unix system on something that is not working 100% to give up choices. When you use Windows, MacOS, Android you do not have choices. Choices are dictated from above, like it or not.

As for me every time I have to interact with something that is not BSD or Linux I suffer miserably.

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imdsm 2 hours ago | parent | next [-]

We are trading usability & quality for freedom & privacy. We know that, but we're all so busy that we have to make that trade. I've used linux since 2000 for servers, I've used it (and still do sometimes) for workstations, but even 2026 linux workstations & laptops aren't at where macbooks were 15 years ago.

Yes, there is a whole moral discussion to be had, but as much as you win points for doing the better thing, the better things don't really pay bills.

The good news though is that we definitely won the server war. We can spin up VMs and install Linux without licences. We have access to software that works well, security updates, frequent releases, a massive ecosystem of free software, no advertising, very little to no licensing for software, and it works incredibly well. So much so, that we can't even imagine a world in which servers require licence keys or subscriptions or a marketplace account.

Imagine now, if laptops & workstations were as solved as servers are.

That's why we aren't there yet, because they're not.

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baxtr 2 hours ago | parent | next [-]

Some people don’t understand the concept of trade-offs

Some people understand the concept of trade-offs but don’t understand how other people don’t want the same trade-offs as they do

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Forgeties79 an hour ago | parent [-]

It goes beyond that if you ask me. I think anybody in this discussion knows all these things, but ultimately they fall back to “…and my decision is the correct one.”

	▲	someguyiguess 17 minutes ago \| parent [-]
		That sentiment is rampant on this site.

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prmoustache 17 minutes ago | parent | prev | next [-]

> We are trading usability & quality for freedom & privacy.

Are we? Not sure what usability and quality improvement there are in an OS where you have to fight against its vendor's decision.

Most critics against Linux I read come from people who never took the time to choose perfectly supported hardware in the first place but just buy whatever bleeding edge stuff is available running on windows, then hope it will works. It is like criticizing Apple/macOS because it doesn't work well on an hackintosh really and is completely dishonest. I don't criticize windows because it doesn't work on the latest Macbook M8 ultra studio pro nor do I criticize iOS because it doesn't work on my Samsung Note tab 6 or macOS 27 because it doesn't work on a Microsoft Surface.

I haven't had any update nor hardware support issue in the last 15 years because I have chosen hardware based on Linux support compatibility before purchasing them.

	▲	intrasight 4 minutes ago \| parent \| next [-]
		I don't even get the "quality hardware" argument. The only hardware I interact with is my high quality mechanical keyboard, trackball, and color calibrated monitor. All are vastly superior to any Apple hardware that I would interact with.
	▲	monkey_monkey a minute ago \| parent \| prev [-]
		[delayed]

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BoxwoodSeed 32 minutes ago | parent | prev [-]

Isn't the only difference that people using servers are expected to have deeper knowledge? As someone using Linux both on servers and on a desktop, I see little difference.

Apple doesn't even have a tiling window manager as far as I know.

	▲	someguyiguess 17 minutes ago \| parent [-]
		They have one built in now and have had third party ones for over a decade. I used SizeUp to tile windows in Mac OS in 2013. Now the OS has it built in but I find Rectangle to be superior. And it’s free and much better than any window manager I’ve tried in any Linux Distro.

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pattle 42 minutes ago | parent | prev | next [-]

The thing is most people don't care about having a choice, they just want it to work. In fact having choice taken away from them is a good thing.

Probably 99% of Apple / Windows users aren't very tech literate so if they have to fight an update they'll just think it's broken.

It's just basic business practice, cater to the 99%, don't worry about the 1%

	▲	someguyiguess 13 minutes ago \| parent [-]
		Yeah but the 1% can still accomplish whatever they want. It just may require a bit of code. No big deal if you’re in the 1%. And you get the added benefit of automatic security updates that don’t break critical system components like what happens from time to time in every Linux distro I’ve ever used over the last 20 years.

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someguyiguess 18 minutes ago | parent | prev | next [-]

That simply isn’t true. You can disable whatever you want. You just may not be able to do it through the UI. I’ve customized my Mac to never phone home. It’s not hard if you know what you’re doing. It’s even easier if you don’t, and just ask Claude code to do it.

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kingkawn 24 minutes ago | parent | prev [-]

Nobody is fooling themselves about this, we have stuff to do with the device beyond focusing on it