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| ▲ | matheusmoreira 6 hours ago | parent | next [-] | | And parents are assumed to be responsible for their own children, not governments or corporations. | | |
| ▲ | sihnsionio 16 minutes ago | parent | next [-] | | They are not. Parents are allowed to make decisions for their children within a narrow range of parameters. No drinking, no smoking, no sex, no violence (except in certain shithole jurisdictions). Education, food, and medical treatment are all mandatory (again, except in certain shithole jurisdictions). | |
| ▲ | layer8 6 hours ago | parent | prev [-] | | I agree about corporations. But alcohol and tobacco are generally prohibited from being sold to children; do you disagree with such laws? They help ensure that the parents aren’t bypassed. I agree that children should be able to use LLMs under parental supervision. | | |
| ▲ | matheusmoreira 6 hours ago | parent [-] | | > But alcohol and tobacco are generally prohibited from being sold to children; do you disagree with such laws? Yes, but merely on principle. I think alcohol and tobacco should be straight up banned unconditionally. Society resists this, so they banned them for children instead and called it a day. I don't accept these ineffectual political concessions. If a thing is bad for children, then it's in all likelihood just as bad for the adults as well. So go all the way and ban it for everybody, not just children. Do it right, don't come up with these half measures that dehumanize children as a side effect. | | |
| ▲ | layer8 6 hours ago | parent [-] | | There is a trade-off between freedom and keeping people safe, and there is an argument for some level of personal responsibility. I’m glad that I can drink alcohol once in a while without becoming an outlaw, even though I know the effects aren’t harmless. I also disagree with the dehumanization argument. Yes, the concrete age limits are a bit arbitrary, and actual maturity depends on the individual and is a spectrum, but regulations necessarily have to come with some level of pigeonholing. The fact that you may have to show your ID when buying alcohol isn’t dehumanizing. | | |
| ▲ | matheusmoreira 5 hours ago | parent [-] | | > I’m glad that I can drink alcohol once in a while without becoming an outlaw, even though I know the effects aren’t harmless. I'm sure teenagers feel the same way. | | |
| ▲ | layer8 5 hours ago | parent | next [-] | | So you’re saying that maturity should be completely disregarded? I don’t get your point. | | |
| ▲ | matheusmoreira 4 hours ago | parent [-] | | The point is the argument is invalid. Why is it that adults get to freely fuck their lives up? If it's bad enough to ban for kids, then it's probably bad enough to ban society wide. "Children" needs further qualification as well. Anglosphere calls anything under 18 years old a "child", which completely disregards adolescence where major brain development takes place. Some five year old generally isn't capable of deciding things, but teenagers absolutely are. |
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| ▲ | 5 hours ago | parent | prev [-] | | [deleted] |
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| ▲ | Muhammad523 6 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-] | | In fact, a 17-year-old is clueless while a person one year older isn't | | |
| ▲ | CrazyStat 5 hours ago | parent | next [-] | | If a law is going to treat 5 year olds differently from 50 year olds then a line has to be drawn somewhere. 18 is arbitrary, but no more arbitrary than any other age you could pick. | | |
| ▲ | matheusmoreira 4 hours ago | parent [-] | | The law could evaluate people as individuals instead of conjuring up some idiotic magic number. | | |
| ▲ | CrazyStat 3 hours ago | parent [-] | | The whole purpose of law is to be a uniform system of justice. At best it could offer guidelines for how to evaluate people: perhaps level of education attained, demonstrated ability to take responsibility for themselves, etc. But the evaluation under those guidelines would
still have to be made by humans. There is precedent for such a system, e.g. minors can petition to be emancipated which allows them to be treated in many regards like an adult. | | |
| ▲ | matheusmoreira 2 hours ago | parent [-] | | > perhaps level of education attained, demonstrated ability to take responsibility for themselves, etc. Yes, that is what I meant. Choosing some arbitrary magic number like 18 and declaring that anyone under that age is too dumb or too irresponsible to decide is about as stupid as declaring that anyone over 65 is incapable of decision making because they might have Alzheimer's. | | |
| ▲ | CrazyStat 31 minutes ago | parent [-] | | Ok, but this doesn’t scale well. It takes a nontrivial amount of time to evaluate each person, and it would have to be done repeatedly as they age. You would need an entire government bureaucracy devoted to it. Then people will want an appeals process for when decisions don’t go their way—both parents and children. |
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| ▲ | 6 hours ago | parent | prev [-] | | [deleted] |
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| ▲ | sdiupIGPWEfh 6 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-] | | Right, but in this case, exposure is a work requirement, which is a bit different. While an employer isn't going to require tobacco use, work involving asbestos exposure is still a thing (removal perhaps), and an employer knowingly or negligently requiring work activity without both risk disclosure and supply of proper safety equipment would face legal action. Hence, if mandatory workplace use of AI inflicts harm, then I could imagine things playing out similarly. The damage slowly accumulates, may or may not be noticed in time, becomes difficult to pin down on a past employer, and when you finally realize you need to sue for damages, both the employer responsible and the system are rigged to drag out the process until you're hopefully old and dead before you have a chance to win your case. ...oh. | |
| ▲ | jbs789 6 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-] | | brains develop with age, generally | | | |
| ▲ | eurothings 6 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-] | | > Mandatory warnings like for tobacco lol that’ll work | |
| ▲ | 3 hours ago | parent | prev [-] | | [deleted] |
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