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zamadatix 8 hours ago

It should probably be noted changing the regulatory region of an RF device may result in you using illegal frequencies in your area depending on the combination of which region you're in and which region you're setting it to.

zamadatix 2 hours ago | parent | next [-]

5 replies saying the same things appeared so I'll respond to myself rather than try to pick one:

A TV is indeed typically a client. Or station, if you want to dust off your CWNA certificate. One should still include the warning when sharing such projects/advice because of considerations like:

- With no explanations or warnings, the reader may very reasonably apply the same type of fix across several of their badly preconfigured devices. Now when they extend their Windows laptop display wirelessly to the TV over Miracast (a direct exchange this TV supports), both devices will agree they can do so on the bands in whatever region they were set to.

- It's not safe to assume only the AP needs and has a correct regulatory db or regulatory domain set. APs for the wrong region are sold/imported, do not always have correct regulatory dbs, and can also be similarly misconfigured. Clients can also peer to peer or hotspot. In general, you should fairly be warned you're removing one of the 2 sides to the safety system and "the channel I wanted appeared" is not the same thing as "I fixed the buggy channel config on the device".

- As some have pointed out, clients can perform either an active or passive scan based on, basically, what the system feels makes the most sense at the time. An active scan will result in probes across the supported channel list, so even if all of the above is true, people should be aware even a lone station can still transmit on all of the bands it is told to support.

I'm not against fixing buggy devices but I am against telling people the fix is to set it to Germany without warning they may result in using illegal frequencies in your area if not carefully considered. A muuuch cooler & safer fix might have been to patch the supported channel list for the given country to be correct rather than patch the region to be wrong, but that may have been harder to pull off.

dcow an hour ago | parent [-]

And what people also don't realize is that you can run a non-compliant AP. I am 99% certain the legal framework places the responsibility on the clients and the APs (or at least the absence of a consistent one biases towards a conservative stance: i.e. not assuming it's only the AP's responsibility). If I am a massive multinational conglomerate and I ship clients that know they're in a regulated region but connect on illegal bands anyway to APs broadcasting them, then that seems to expose me to unnecessary risk. You can bet I'm going to take measures so that if this ever gets tested in court I can say "yes our software takes reasonable measures to not transmit on channels we know to be illegal in your country, your honor".

embedding-shape 8 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

Yeah, not sure if author knows, they certainly don't share if they understand this or not, but these things aren't available because the some governments say those frequencies are illegal to use. Turkey for example has multiple frequencies under 5Ghz WiFi that is banned, hence consumer don't get to use 5Ghz WiFi. If you change that, you're breaking the law and you might get a visit, depending on how hardcore they are about the rules. Tend to be pretty strict and swift payback when it comes to using frequencies you shouldn't, as they're used for other stuff and easily seen when other traffic appears.

delamon 7 hours ago | parent | next [-]

> Turkey for example has multiple frequencies under 5Ghz WiFi that is banned, hence consumer don't get to use 5Ghz WiFi.

Are you sure? According to wiki, there are plenty allowed 5GHz channels in Turkey.

embedding-shape 5 hours ago | parent [-]

> Are you sure? According to wiki, there are plenty allowed 5GHz channels in Turkey.

Pretty, yeah. Doesn't the same wiki page list a bunch of not-allowed 5Ghz channels too? Or only allowed ones?

I didn't mean to claim it's completely banned, but some channels are, which leads to some hardware makers to just eschew the entire 5Ghz stuff instead of just specific channels, like what this submission is about.

fxd 7 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

[flagged]

tigereyeTO 6 hours ago | parent | next [-]

In addition to the other (great) reply pointing out the difference between 5G and 5Ghz, there is also the nuance of channels within the 5Ghz band. While the band may be lawfully used within a region, some channels within that band may be banned.

So it’s not enough to say “we have 5Ghz wifi here so it’s fine” because there are many channels within that band which may not all be treated equally.

jshier 7 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

5G the cellular connection, or 5GHz bands for wifi? GP was talking about wifi.

Avamander 8 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

If it's a station (client) then it's unlikely, as long as your APs are compliant.

With some chipsets it can end up being entirely ass-backwards - if you use an Intel WiFi chipset, a nearby AP can broadcast the wrong region and cripple your connectivity.

Outdated regulatory databases and firmware efforts by vendors have generally made both illegal and legal usage beyond ch 1-12 at 2.4GHz rather difficult.

yardie 7 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

It's wifi. The client and the base have to negotiate a channel they both can see. If the AP is compliant for it's region than you can assume the client will have to be as well.

BTW, I'm someone that use to by US region coded 802.11b wifi devices to get the 13th channel. Except for exploring, it was rarely useful since none of my other devices could connect on it.

mixdup 6 hours ago | parent [-]

You will still be making transmissions on the illegal frequencies even if there is no one on the other end of the connection

StrLght 7 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

TV is a client. If I remember correctly, it shouldn't transmit anything (unless connected) other than probe requests during active scanning.

Which could still be illegal, but I don't think anyone will realistically investigate a low-power device sending a few packets occasionally.

apefulsin 3 hours ago | parent [-]

That depends what else is on the channel that is the reason for it not being available for wifi. In some places, it's a military radar and they will definitely investigate.

BlackRabbit1 8 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

You mean that this helicopter hovering about my home is looking out for me?

_davide_ 7 hours ago | parent [-]

Oh no, again

izacus 7 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

This is about a WiFi client - on WiFi networks the AP station chooses frequency and manufacturers/driver writers fuck up legal frequency lists and regulatory codes all the time.