The construction manager can’t say they built a skyscraper? In that only for someone who personally laid every brick and ran every wire?

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10 hours ago | parent | next [-]

[deleted]

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short_sells_poo 19 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

No they can't. The construction crew - which includes the manager - can say that they built a skyscraper.

If the construction manager did lay the bricks or did the majority of the work in all aspects, they could claim to have built a building. Otherwise they contributed work, no denying that, but they can't claim credit for building it. Same way that architects can't claim they built the skyscraper, even though they probably spent a lot of effort designing it to specs. To the best of my knowledge, no serious architect claims they "built" the building. They have designed it yes. Same way, the construction manager would claim they have managed the construction.

I admit that the classification is fuzzy, but there's an explosion of vibe coders going about claiming to have built things, whose contribution is basically spending a total of one hour with a prompt and and LLM doing basically all the heavy lifting.

That's not necessarily the case of the author here, but the line has blurred a lot and people very giddily claim credit for much less actual accomplishment than what would've flown in the past.

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sbarre 15 hours ago | parent | next [-]

I think you're being pedantic to the point of losing all credibility. And you're gatekeeping in the worst possible way.

Your argument that using an LLM means you didn't "make" a thing could just as easily be used to say that if you used a framework or a library, you also didn't "make" a thing, because you didn't write all the code yourself and you didn't understand everything.

Would you say the authors of YT-DLP didn't "make" anything because they are a wrapper over FFMPEG and CURL?

If you produce something useful (even just to yourself), you "made" a thing.. It has a purpose, and it's useful. Who cares how you made it or how long it took?

For example I've made plenty of bash scripts over the years that were effectively thin wrappers that combined other tools, but they did something novel and useful that saved me tons of time, and I've shared those as gists or in other ways.

Some of these scripts took me mere minutes to make. I didn't use an LLM to make them, but the "heavy lifting" definitely wasn't in my script. No one ever showed up to berate me and try to tell me that I didn't actually produce anything useful in any of these cases.

So this "in the past" that you imagine where people were held to some bullshit standard for what is accepted as "making" a thing?

That past doesn't really exist, and if does where you are, it sucks.

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cityoften 14 hours ago | parent [-]

People do care - lots of people do. Maybe you don’t, and maybe the argument the other poster made wasn’t fair, but you make just as spurious claims when you say „who cares how you made it or how long it took?”

	▲	sbarre 14 hours ago \| parent [-]
		Really? You care about some stranger's work and how they created it? Pro tip: you shouldn't. Care about your work if you want, but "caring" about how someone else makes things and how they talk about it is just being a judgemental busybody and again, gatekeeping. As for my comment, I stand by it. If I made something genuinely useful, then it should not matter if it took me 5 minutes or 5 days to make it. You'll never convince me that more time spent making something (all other factors being equal - yes, quality matters) gives it more value or credibility.

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eli 10 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

OK, clear enough. But that's an unusual definition of "build" that I don't think you should necessarily expect others to share.

The first entry for "build" in the OED is: To construct, put up, erect (a house or other dwelling or building); to construct (a permanent static structure such as a wall, bridge, or architectural feature, a road or railway, etc.). Also: to commission, finance, direct, or oversee the construction of (something of this type).

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bayindirh 19 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

But they know the plans, and knows people where all the wires are, etc.

With vibe coding you know nothing.