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| ▲ | rickydroll 16 hours ago | parent | next [-] | | Yes, a carbon tax would go a long way, but I think a broader view is to look for ways to use taxes to shift externalities back onto the organizations that created the problem. For example, data centers (a popular demon). The two main externalities are water consumption and power consumption. The tariffs for providing those services to a data center should be high enough to compensate the rest of the community for the impact the data center has on the community. For example, tariffs could be used to subsidize non-data-center power users. Higher tariffs could also be used to fund community solar and community BESS, helping provide greater local grid resilience. For example, the tariffs should be high enough to subsidize everybody else so they don't have to pay more for their electric service, roughly speaking. I would also advocate closing the on-prem generator loophole by classifying on-prem power generation services as belonging to or leased from local utilities, and setting the tariff for locally generated power to match the tariff they pay for drawing from the grid. | | |
| ▲ | esseph 16 hours ago | parent [-] | | > I would also advocate closing the on-prem generator loophole by classifying on-prem power generation services as belonging to or leased from local utilities, Congrats, now all power generation is owned by the power company, including your own solar, wind, and fossil fuel generation. | | |
| ▲ | danans 16 hours ago | parent | next [-] | | > your own solar, wind, and fossil fuel generation. The OP was clearly talking about on premises primary power generation for datacenters. The utility doesn't have a way to own my residential generation. | | |
| ▲ | rickydroll 11 hours ago | parent [-] | | They kinda do via net metering tariffs and curtailment. I'm a big fan of 0 export systems as a way to keep more for yourself. Now if one could get spot prices and sell your power then...the system gets more interesting. | | |
| ▲ | danans 10 hours ago | parent [-] | | > They kinda do via net metering tariffs and curtailment. They don't own your system through net metering. If you have net metering you are using the grid as a battery, which has a cost - the infrastructure to support net metering isn't free. For a long time residential solar customers (like me) were being subsidized for the upstream load we put on the grid. > Now if one could get spot prices and sell your power then...the system gets more interesting. They are running a pilot of this in California (PG&E): https://www.pge.com/en/account/rate-plans/hourly-flex-pricin... It's currently restricted to downstream only customers. They plan to admit net metering customers to the pilot in the future. Even outside of that, anyone can enroll a home battery in a demand response program to make money by supporting the grid during peak hours. | | |
| ▲ | rickydroll 9 hours ago | parent [-] | | That's why I said kinda. Strictly speaking, you are right. They don't own your system. However, to me if somebody controls what you do with your electricity I.e export or curtailed, you don't own the the work product of your system. Virtual power plant model you've described doesn't exist here in New England. National grid has some sort of thing where you can make a grand or two a year if they can use your battery during times of high demand. If I could do it standard off-the-shelf components, I could put together such a system for $6,000 installed but the payoff is in the decade range since we have flat rate power through municipal buying co-op. |
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| ▲ | rickydroll 11 hours ago | parent | prev [-] | | An alternative would be a local tax on generator hours. |
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| ▲ | dgellow 16 hours ago | parent | prev [-] | | I don’t know what the comment you responded to said, give it is flagged. But really, the time for carbon taxes was 15y ago. It’s not such a small bandaid compared to the size of the problem |
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