From somebody else's post, to be clear. So the point is ... the coal-smoke environments of the industrial revolution, which replaced natural environments, were also awful, being full of grime and cinders instead of sweat and insects. For this reason we progressed even further. You might observe that we're never satisfied, but that doesn't mean that all situations are equivalent and activity is futile.

The title says hunter gatherers. That's totally different from life 150 years ago. It's even different from the medieval or agrarian iron age times.

Aww, you don't get it - steam trains are so cool! :)

Just don't get the embers into your eyes and it will be fine. :)

The "cut and die" part is happening rather quickly, and you're done with it. But you might be hungry for weeks and have to watch your crops grow. Probably really boring and uncomfortable.

Love it and totally agree. The comfort we think we need is nothing else than hedonic adaptation.

> in a “civilized” lifestyle that you no longer even notice because you’re just so used to accommodating them: traffic noise, pollution, artificial light, etc.

But I don't have any of those for there's a whole spectrum between "go one week hiking" and "live in a city".

I have spent enough time in nature to know what what I like and don’t like. I am 43 years old, and grew up with a family who went camping multiple times a year all through my childhood. I have some good memories, but I always looked forward to going home to my air conditioner and computers.

I enjoy some time in the forests, especially here in California, and I enjoy short hikes and mountains and the ocean (although I really hate sand.)

Part of it is allergies; I recently was finally tested, and it turns out I am severely allergic to almost all trees and grasses, which explains why I always get so itchy when I am out in nature. I am doing weekly shots to help, and have taken allergy medicine for years (even before I was tested), so we will see if that gets better.

I don’t know what to say about the hot and sweaty and bugs other than to say I think I know myself, and tried for decades to push through those feelings because everyone told me the same thing as you, that being in nature was so great and those things are just part of it and to power through. It never happened for me, and I find the opposite to be true for me… I can power through the discomfort for a while, but eventually it gets to be too much and I need to get away somewhere cool and clean.

I get that you are trying to be helpful and are sharing your experience, but the idea that I am somehow just not understanding how to enjoy nature properly a bit condescending. As I said, I am 43 years old and have spent a ton of time in nature. I have young children, and want them to be able to experience nature, too, so I do spend quite a bit of time in nature these days, because I do think it is important for them.

I have lived in large cities and suburbs, I know the trade offs for both. I agree about the annoyance of traffic and other attributes of the city.

However, you don’t really suffer many of them while you are inside of your house. I have a perfect little personal bubble, where I control the temperature and sounds and light levels. I just like being inside my house, I have infinite things I want to do here.

I have also learned great ways to enjoy nature in my own manner over the years. Our family doesn’t camp, but we do love to rent cabins in the woods. We can go on hikes, the kids can play around in the trees, but then we can go inside and turn on the AC and take warm showers and sleep in nice clean beds.

That is how I like to enjoy nature, on my terms.

I used to feel guilty about this (and a lot of my other preferences that always made me feel like I was doing something wrong or not enjoying life properly, like my dislike of crowds and partying), but as I have gotten older I have become a lot more comfortable with myself and who I am, and no longer feel the need to try to fit in with what I am supposed to like. Finding my wife helped a lot, because she is similar to me and we are very compatible in our lifestyles. Now that I found a partner and have my own family, I no longer feel the need to fit in with how others think I should live my life.

So I hope you really enjoy your trips in nature, and continue to experience it however you want. I will do the same.

I am 43 years old and have been to many countries and locales. I have enjoyed nature plenty of times. I like short hikes, and pretty views, and seeing different types of nature. I just like to go home to a nice air conditioned room, with a warm shower and clean bed afterwards, and I only want to spend a smaller fraction of my time out in nature.

I live in Southern California, where the temperature is amazing all year round. It doesn’t matter, I still get sweaty and sticky when I am out in nature. We don’t even have many bugs here, it is nothing like when I visit family in Wisconsin or New York, so I don’t know of many places I can go that it will be better.

That sounds nice. Which parts of the globe do you recommend for such a lifestyle? I assume your not a digital nomad but rather deeply embedded in your environment? Would love to learn more about this lifestyle. Want online resources you can recommend?

I'm sure they did.

Buddhist's view everyday existence within samsara (the cycle of rebirth) as inherently marked by dissatisfaction, pain, and impermanence.

Those kinds of beliefs reflect the lived reality of our ancestors.

I 100% agree with this, and I fully support people who want to live their lives however they want to. I have no delusions that my preferences are universal.

I just want others to accept the same about me and my preferences.