| ▲ | jmclnx 7 hours ago |
| Yet another case that will waste the court's time and money. All this is doing is keeping defense lawyers pocket's lined. At this point, people should buy a burner phone when going to/from the US. In that phone only have a couple of phone numbers and that's it. |
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| ▲ | laughing_man an hour ago | parent | next [-] |
| I'm a bit mystified why anyone would bring an electronic device over an international border with anything that could be construed, fairly or not, as evidence of criminal behavior. |
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| ▲ | Sharlin 7 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-] |
| Oh, they may well give you bad time if your phone looks like a burner with too little content. |
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| ▲ | GJim 7 hours ago | parent | next [-] | | > Oh, they may well give you bad time if your phone looks like a burner with too little content. Issuing 'burner phones' and laptops to staff visiting countries such as China or the USA is now SOP for many companies handling sensitive data, including mine. Don't think this isn't unusual. | | |
| ▲ | iamnothere 6 hours ago | parent [-] | | Exactly, these people making shit up about border crossings are either doing so in bad faith or haven’t done a lot of international business travel. |
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| ▲ | nucleardog 7 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-] | | This is not... advice. But if anyone's actually going to do this, the method that's worked for me... A couple weeks before your trip, factory reset whatever burner phone you're planning on using and swap your SIM card over. Install a few basic apps you wouldn't mind them looking through. Enable hotspot/tethering, and connect your other phone via Wi-Fi. For a couple of weeks, use the burner as much as you can with what is available on it. When you're driving, us the maps app for GPS. Make and receive some calls, ignore some spam calls. Read the news. Get a few inane text messages conversations going, etc. When you travel, leave your regular phone at home and take the burner. When it's searched at the border, it has enough activity to pass most initial smell tests. If asked, you dropped your other phone and didn't have time to get it fixed before your trip, this is one a friend lent you. This has worked for me. Never _actually_ into anything illegal, but just apparently had a suspicious vibe about me or something because every time I crossed the border into or out of the country I was spending 4-5 hours getting searched. Didn't need someone going through my entire life going back decades every time--once was enough. | |
| ▲ | iamnothere 7 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-] | | If you are a citizen it doesn’t matter. They have to let you in. | | |
| ▲ | lovich an hour ago | parent | next [-] | | According to this admin due process is only for citizens, and since we’ve claimed you aren’t a citizen you have no due process to prove otherwise. | |
| ▲ | ydat 7 hours ago | parent | prev [-] | | Wouldn’t be the first time the US government grossly abused its own citizens and violated their rights | | |
| ▲ | iamnothere 6 hours ago | parent [-] | | And yet this distant possibility doesn’t seem to happen very often to citizens, as long as we still have courts. Not that actual abuses should be trivialized. This comes across as fearmongering to keep people from protecting themselves. |
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| ▲ | skinfaxi 7 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-] | | If you are a citizen like this person is then you can tell them to fuck off, they can keep the phone, and they have to let you in. | | |
| ▲ | nucleardog 7 hours ago | parent [-] | | They have to let you in. Doesn't mean they have to let you roam the country freely. They can just send you to some form of detention. | | |
| ▲ | laughing_man an hour ago | parent | next [-] | | They can hold you for a few hours while they investigate, but they can't just arbitrarily detain you without a legal basis. | |
| ▲ | iamnothere 7 hours ago | parent | prev [-] | | That isn’t true. They can detain you briefly for questioning at the border, but if there is no crime then you will be released. Feel free to dig into historical court cases about border detention if you disagree. If you get charged with a crime, things are very different. | | |
| ▲ | nucleardog 7 hours ago | parent [-] | | Nope, no disagreement. I just see your take as very optimistic. There is no court at the border. If the agent decides you're going to jail, you're going to jail. The decision may be reversed/corrected after, but it's still going to be a big, expensive problem for you and you _are_ going to be detained for a time. Not to mention walking up with an empty phone and telling the agent to "fuck off" when they ask about it sure sounds eerily similar to the facts of the case in the linked article. I'd wager that's a good way to land an obstruction charge. | | |
| ▲ | iamnothere 6 hours ago | parent [-] | | If the abuse is egregious, you have a decent chance of pro bono representation or a lawsuit payout. In any case, activism comes with personal risk, and part of activism is accepting that risk while attempting to protect others. (This person was an activist, and it’s likely that they wanted to confine the damage to themselves.) For the second part, having an empty phone is not a crime, and being arrested for this would be a major scandal. The tech press and political outlets would be all over it. It’s generally a good idea to avoid directly antagonizing border guards, though. |
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| ▲ | bdangubic 7 hours ago | parent | prev [-] | | They won't unless you are already on "their list" My phone basically looks like a burner phone, I do not use social media, do not install apps, my iphone fits (with room to spare) all "apps" on a "single page." I just call and text from my phone and have a browser and maps and that is basically it. |
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| ▲ | ramgine 7 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-] |
| Think it’s better to travel without a phone at all and buy one when arriving in the us? Problematic I guess with everything being digital |
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| ▲ | hylaride 39 minutes ago | parent | next [-] | | Years ago I chatted with a border guard from another country about their job (while they were not working). Not having a phone nowadays would be considered "strange" enough to flag you. If you're not a citizen of said country, it could even dramatically increase the odds of disallowing you entry. Often this would prevent you returning for a set number of years. At the end of the day, it's always best to just not have anything "bad" on your devices. People have been caught up for all numbers of "innocent" reasons (pictures of their kids in the bathtub, ancient photos in their albums of themselves doing illegal things such as drugs or underage drinking, text messages or browser history disparaging politicians the border guard may support, porn in your history) that can give a border guard in a bad mood good reason to ruin your day. I personally don't want my phone data hoovered in and analyzed or marked, even though I don't really have anything to hide. I don't care enough to do anything about it, but if I did I would probably have a second travel phone with a curated amount of data, apps, accounts, etc. | |
| ▲ | laughing_man an hour ago | parent | prev | next [-] | | The last time I tried to do that on a trip to Germany, admittedly many years ago, I found I could not get phone service without a local address. | |
| ▲ | 59nadir an hour ago | parent | prev | next [-] | | If you can, just avoid ever entering the US at all. | |
| ▲ | hamper653 6 hours ago | parent | prev [-] | | It has been standard practice for some time now in some European companies. |
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| ▲ | iamnothere 7 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-] |
| Also, you might accidentally drop your burner in the lake/ocean before you return. It happens! |
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| ▲ | hamper653 6 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-] |
| > At this point, people should buy a burner phone when going to/from the US. At this point? This has been standard practice for a while now. |
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| ▲ | 7 hours ago | parent | prev [-] |
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