But the mechanics to work around it, and potentially slip something onto my phone, are already in there. No, thanks. The problem with this wholeEU bullshit is that the pro-consumer and pro-security do not always go hand in hand. And relevant dept lawyers don’t always communicate sufficiently.

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xp84 8 hours ago | parent [-]

Okay Tim Cook.

If the App Store is such a customer-friendly shield, then why are there millions of scam apps in the App Store?

To combat software threats, sandboxing and fine-grained permissions (which Apple basically pioneered in the consumer space!) is the answer. App Review can't catch all malicious actors. When a vulnerability exists in the sandbox, the exploit can easily be slipped past App Review, with a feature flag holding it until the scammer is ready to attack.

App Review, Notarization, etc. isn't for us. It's for Apple. It's the control that allows them to extract the money. Simple as that. Without the control, only small indie developers would list on the App Store because it's (A) shitty in quality, (B) shitty in financial terms, and (C) shitty at keeping people safe from scams.

If you want proof of that, look at the tumbleweeds in the Mac App Store, where it's not mandatory and anyone can distribute an app in a zip file, and where notarization hasn't (yet) been weaponized to censor apps[1] for reasons having nothing to do with platform security.

No one wants to use the MAS, so they don't, and Apple doesn't get to take 30% of all revenue for every app distributed. You can see why they are fighting tooth and nail to not have the much more important iOS platform turned into that.

[1] https://mjtsai.com/blog/2024/06/14/utm-blocked-outside-app-s...

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throw1234567891 8 hours ago | parent [-]

I’m not Tim Cook. You need to send an email to him, apparently he reads them. Anyway, I still prefer that instead of having a risk accidentally installing some shit scam app from literally anywhere on the internet. Is it so difficult to understand the difference? At least I can hold Apple liable when I buy a scam app on their App Store. What you propose is basically shareware of 1990s. Zero security.

Don’t get me even started on the hypocrisy of the people wanting what you propose. So, the reason you want to build an app for iOS is that there are many of us. There are many of us because of App Store, mainly, as an end user. Pick one. You are proposing breaking the only platform making the iPhone an interesting product for a computer illiterate.

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xp84 8 hours ago | parent [-]

> having a risk accidentally installing some shit scam app from literally anywhere on the internet

Don't install random shit scam apps then. It's easy. Just don't do it. Use the App Store. Just because you trust them doesn't mean the entire userbase should all be forced to trust Apple and only Apple.

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throw1234567891 8 hours ago | parent [-]

I just told you in this thread that I don’t. Explain that to your mother! Or your paps, or your little kid.

I have my popcorn ready for the new wave of installing malware apps through some click jacking scams.

	▲	xp84 2 hours ago \| parent [-]
		It's such a bad argument, the 'but grandma will install malware' excuse. By that logic we also need to fully lock down the Mac, Windows, and Linux the same way because Granny might get scammed there, too. Apple must approve all software. Again, Apple already allows grannies to be scammed with apps right on the App Store. Apps which are advertised by web popups that try to stop you from going Back, and throw up "You're INFECTED!" warnings and alerts. Then they route you to the App Store to get the scammy apps, with often weekly subscriptions. Apple routinely lets these listings stay up for a long time. I can see an app right now called "Storage Cleaner_ Phone Cleanup" It charges victims $9.99 a month to pretend to do several things that the OS already includes as features. And another one called "Phone Guard: Secure Cleaner" - same basic deal, $6.99 a week. The sandboxing should be what keeps us safe from "malware" -- these apps don't have root. They can't access your phone's contacts without explicit permission, nor take control of the radios, nor replace your system apps. Apple can't or won't keep people safe on the App Store. But they still use this line about the poor confused grannies and toddlers as an excuse of why we have to let them keep 100% control of every iPhone in the world, in a way that just happens to earn them tens of billions of dollars every year.