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JohnMakin 3 hours ago

You can tell the people pioneering this are utterly miserable and soulless. "Let's build something to automate all the parts of your life that are actually your life."

What person that was even mildly satisfied with living their life would want this? What's next, agents that play video games and watch tv for me? What's the point?

hlynurd 2 hours ago | parent | next [-]

Thanks to people pioneering this I can spend a lot more time on the things I want.

JohnMakin 2 hours ago | parent [-]

" It plans his daughter’s recipes and orders the ingredients."

hlynurd 2 hours ago | parent [-]

Believe or not people pay for others to do this for themselves.

alpha_squared 44 minutes ago | parent | next [-]

I think OPs question still applies.

> What person that was even mildly satisfied with living their life would want this?

sscaryterry 38 minutes ago | parent | prev [-]

Which is the sad part.

dfee 2 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

i have and continue to build a ton of automations against my life. my goal is to offload more and more of my "life" to it.

- bills? bookkeeping? reading DMARC emails? yeah, i want to do none of it, but i desperately want these chores done.

- spend time with kids? study interesting topics? eat and drink interesting things? i want more of this.

apsurd 2 hours ago | parent [-]

life is what happens during all the waiting for life to happen.

exe34 2 hours ago | parent [-]

That's a nice thought terminating cliché.

We get to choose what we want to spend time on and what we would prefer to offload. I'm sure you don't grow your own potatoes.

aureate 22 minutes ago | parent | next [-]

> I'm sure you don't grow your own potatoes.

I do. It's easy, fun and they're nicer (lower water content) than supermarket ones. You don't even need a garden. Can recommend.

sifar an hour ago | parent | prev [-]

>> I'm sure you don't grow your own potatoes.

That, is also a thought terminating cliche. Sure we want to choose what we spend time on, however, we don't know what experiences will meaningfully contribute to our lives. It is only after we have gone through them that we realize which ones were significant. And these vary for everyone.

exe34 41 minutes ago | parent [-]

Isn't it great when we get to try something instead of having to try it?

apsurd 32 minutes ago | parent [-]

umm, its like the hallmark of adulthood to learn that life is a lot about doing things you don't want to do. There's obviously a spectrum. And I don't mean forcibly through coercion. I mean yeah it sucks to wake up early and clean up and get your exercise in and be accountable to your team or take your kid to basketball practice or feed the cat. Or go out your way to pick up that trash someone else threw out, or let someone go ahead of you in traffic even though you were there first or take the stairs because someone is moving in today and needs the elevator more than you or take your dad to dialysis and listen to him mention the same things 5 times, there and back or not just eat anything you want whenever you want.

I don't know it sounds like you're advocating for doing only things you want to do. Automate everything else. It's all philosophy at this point. Life doesn't really work that way "and it shouldn't" - where shouldn't is wholly in the philosophy category, of course.

exe34 23 minutes ago | parent [-]

You left out washing your clothes in the river, carrying water from the well, butchering a chicken for dinner, walking ten miles uphill both ways and a whole lot of things that you seem to have automated away.

apsurd 15 minutes ago | parent [-]

haha you're right! That is the entire nuance of the discussion. There's a line somewhere in there. And it's not as pedantic as it seems. I still do cook my own food. I don't grow it and butcher the meat. But thousands of years of cooking people still cook food. (and not me but people do still grow their own food).

Efficiency and automation isn't some objective linear path toward enlightenment, that's not unreasonable, is it?

And you might say "people cook because they want to". Not exactly given the whole socioeconomic realities. But also "want to" is nuanced. Cooking is a lot of work and there's many parts of it annoying. It's worth it. <insert philosophy on value and how to assess value and is hedonism 'value based' and how can we know>

heaney-555 2 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

People said this about every new convenience, such as email over physical mail, buying things online instead of in stores, etc. It's a tired argument.

estearum 2 hours ago | parent | next [-]

It seems quite clear at this point that important parts of our social and economic fabric are in fact damaged by people buying everything online, ordering food delivery, drive-through windows, streaming movies, and so on

apsurd 2 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

but why is it a tired argument?

You'd clearly never believe this but there's even an argument that cars are of dubious benefit to society. Personal/passenger cars mostly in that they've reshaped our entire civilized landscape to be inhumane and all the long-term and downstream health effects that that entails.

interstice 2 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

Freedom to decide? Not that humanity is historically great at deciding what brings itself happiness.

Insanity 2 hours ago | parent [-]

Humanity or humans? Individual humans could, but as a collective we make stupid choices.

estearum 2 hours ago | parent [-]

Humans are quite bad at doing what brings them (durable) happiness

IncreasePosts 2 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

What scenarios are you imagining where people are automating away the interesting parts of their life ?

Searching for a new movie to watch can be fun in itself, but it ight not be want I want to do at any specific point in time. So what's so bad about having a system offer me a recommendation?

JohnMakin 2 hours ago | parent [-]

A use case provided in this very article is "plans daughter's recipes and orders the ingredients." The whole act of doing that without automating it is what makes it meaningful.

What a miserable mindset.

bronco21016 an hour ago | parent | next [-]

Isn't it a bit of a spectrum of ways to tackle this depending on tons of other factors?

For example, baking cookies with my 3 year old means having them help with a couple steps of mixing before interest is lost until the cookies are done. The whole act of planning, shopping, and prepping the kitchen is mostly entirely left out. Now with my 8 year old, the entire "workflow" of "lets bake cookies" to cookies complete is easily done end to end with the child.

My point is the level of "automation" desired for various repetitive tasks in life ebbs and flows on a multitude of external factors. This week I might have a lot going on and don't want to deal with grocery shopping and next week I might be free to go take care of that myself, and find joy in browsing the produce section.

Provided "agents" like these can have interactions where the principle still has agency over which tasks they will or will not do, I don't really see the issues.

Now the whole idea of negotiating this on a day by day basis with the agent and managing said agent sounds like a chore in and of itself and so I'm not sure if it's worth it or not.

BeetleB an hour ago | parent | prev | next [-]

Your comment reminds me of a (single) friend who talked about how he doesn't use dishwashers because he finds the motions of washing them by hand therapeutic.

That's because he rarely cooked, and ate out often. When you get married, cook almost every day, and have kids, washing dishes by hand becomes anything but therapeutic.

Do you have a kid? How often are you cooking for the kid? Doing it multiple times a week for 15+ years becomes a chore. Most of the meals you cook aren't well thought out - they're "Family needs to be fed - what's the quickest thing I can make?" Then, once in a while, you want to put in the effort and cook something nice, and it becomes meaningful. Those have always been the exceptions when both parents have full time jobs.

Getting an algorithm to plan the recipe and order ingredients is for all the other times you cook. Not for the meaningful ones.

It's also not an either/or. You have the freedom to do it as often or as little as you want.

Now here's my question: Say only 10% of the meals you cook are carefully thought out. 90% are done with your brain on autopilot. Are you going to criticize someone for now doing a 10-30-60 split, where the 30% is using some algorithm to actually make something nice for the kid? You're not losing any of the meaningful time you had before.

Another way to frame this: Overworked parents decide to take the family out for junk food once in a while. It's a treat for the kids, and it's a way for the parents to get relief. It's simply another way of outsourcing the labor, just as the AI example is. Do you criticize such parents saying that instead of meaningfully trying to make a nice dinner, they're offloading it to a 3rd party?

qsera 2 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

The trick is to convince young people that it is a good idea before they get a chance to learn that they are literally trading off parts of their life away...

siriusastrebe 2 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

Next you can ask the AI how to teach the kid how to get recipes from AI. A real time saver for both of you.

After that, ask the AI what kind of life lessons are good to impart on your kid.

deadbunny 2 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

Pretty sure the cooking and spending time with their daughter is the meaningful bit for them. Why would they automate the setup steps otherwise?