| For a relatively small battery like that, it's not going to last for days. In the typical outage where that battery would carry you, you can typically just leave the fridge closed and it will stay cold enough to prevent 99% of your stuff from spoiling. For most people (at least the US), it's not super easy to get at the plug in the back of the fridge anyway. Running HVAC is usually more of a concern, especially in winter or peak of summer, and those aren't device that you can hot-plug, and a small battery wouldn't help there anyway. I like the idea of whole-house batteries, but to really make it practical you're talking about thousands of dollars to the battery, install, etc. And you still don't have extensive run time, which is why I think you see most people still leaning towards permanent or portable generators way more than batteries. |
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| ▲ | munificent a day ago | parent [-] | | > It is socially irresponsible that as soon as a service goes out that you are immediately in an emergency. You should not offload basic resiliency on to emergency services. Sure, but that's not a remotely accurate description of a house without a backup battery or generator. I grew up in hurricane country and weathered many bad storms. Losing power does not put you immediately in an emergency. If you don't open the fridge much, your perishables will last a couple of days. Non-perishables will last much longer. Having a battery is the difference between "we can hang out and grill dinner for 5 days before we need to hit the road" and "we can hang out and grill dinner for 6 days before we need to hit the road". That distinction does not significantly change your strategy. Losing water is a much bigger emergency but is thankfully rarer and a backup battery won't help. Climate change will change this story somewhat in the South. If you are in a very hot climate, elderly, or have other health issues, then losing electricity and air conditioning in the summer can be an immediate emergency. Again, though, A/Cs consume so much electricity that a backup battery won't help you much. I think you're significantly overestimating the emergency value of a battery backup. Loss of electricity is rarely a rapid emergency. In cases where it is, a generator will at least give you as much power as you care to store fuel. | | |
| ▲ | jerf a day ago | parent | next [-] | | > > It is socially irresponsible that as soon as a service goes out that you are immediately in an emergency. You should not offload basic resiliency on to emergency services. > Sure, but that's not a remotely accurate description of a house without a backup battery or generator. I don't mean it as one. Resiliency is my end goal, and "a reasonable amount" at that, not "I can reboot civilization from the zombie hordes with just what is in my shed". If you are already resilient with just a house and what it will naturally do without power, hey, great. A battery opens up options, but if it is not worth it, it isn't worth it. It should be a social expectation that you can survive a reasonable 2-3 days without power and whatever other service outage you have without having to immediately hit the stores or drawing on emergency services. I do not care exactly how you achieve that. I don't care if you're carrying on like nothing happened in a well-lit house with AC on full blast or if you're eating beans out of a can and drinking bottled water. I just care that people should be expected to be at least a little resilient, for all sorts of pro-social reasons, that if you have your additional needs like an oxygen machine or necessary medicine that you have the buffer in place, and so on. (Which does imply certain perscription practices keeping you on a short leash are in violation of this, but that's another discussion.) | | |
| ▲ | munificent a day ago | parent [-] | | I mean, it's also a selfish expectation to be able to survive a couple of days without services. As a general rule, people prefer not to die. My point is just that a cheap battery backup does not have a significant effect in the resiliency strategy for most people. I am certainly not a prepper, but even viewing that scene from the outside, it is absolutely rife with what I would call "preparedness theater". Things you can buy (it's always about buying stuff) that would save you in some imagined horrific scenario but where the odds of the scenario happening in just the right arrangement where that object helped are infintesimal. Like, yes, if your car drives into a freezing cold deep lake and you are somehow too incapacitated to open your seatbelt but not too incapacitated to use a knife, then keeping a dive knife in your glove box next to the ceramic "break windshield" thingy might be worth it, but you're more likely to win the lottery than have that happen. There is a set of people whose brains are wired such that they are easily nerd sniped into obsessing about these sorts of things. When they do, they are also compelled to share it and spread it like some kind of mind virus. It takes a certain amount of mental discipline to not fall down every one of those rabbitholes. I believe the author telling the world to arrange joint battery buying parties for friends is well along that path of crazy. Don't waste time and money organizing a joint battery purchase for your friends. Keep some non-perishables and a few gallons of water in your house. Fill your gas tank before it gets all the way to empty. Learn how to cook and some basic first aid. |
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| ▲ | foobarian a day ago | parent | prev | next [-] | | Winter is a better use case, because losing power during deep sub-zero temps can lead to plumbing damage and even be dangerous, but doesn't require too much power if heat uses natural gas as the main power source. | |
| ▲ | tonymet a day ago | parent | prev [-] | | Generators don’t work that well. They need regular use and maintenance. Fuel storage is complicated (you will need 30+ gallons a day, or about 2 sedan tank’s worth. Connecting to your panel is expensive at least $2k+. They are smelly and noisy. And if it’s a real emergency, everyone will know you have one , and eventually come knocking. For $2k you can buy 3 Ankers and distribute around the house. With a propane camp stove you can cook. So the only utility failing during a power outage is your air conn. If it’s winter you can run a gas fireplace to keep warm. In my area we have power outages in the fall and winter wind storms due to trees falling. We need electricity for the fridge, fireplace, lighting , internet & devices. Lithium batteries work great. We get a few outages every season, usually for 2-6 hours . My neighbors have a generator for “emergencies” and don’t end up using it because it’s such a PITA. He has it for SHTF, but then he will have to consume the gas from his cars (and siphon it), which means making the decision between home comfort and evac. My point is that every solution covers a range of scenarios based on convenience, cost, resilience, versatility and more. There is no one size fits all . And now these lithium battery backups provide a broad amount of coverage that is safe and convenient for novices to run. | | |
| ▲ | runako a day ago | parent | next [-] | | People here buy natural gas generators[1] and just connect them into the existing gas lines. (I realize natural gas is not part of the utility mix everywhere.) Gas still flows when power is out, and common generators are big enough to power even A/C. 1 - https://www.homedepot.com/p/Generac-14kW-Air-Cooled-Auto-Sta... | | |
| ▲ | tonymet a day ago | parent [-] | | You’re right it’s more convenient than gasoline, but most of the other hassles apply (dirty/smelly, maintenance, noisy) |
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| ▲ | munificent a day ago | parent | prev | next [-] | | > Generators don’t work that well. They need regular use and maintenance. So do lawnmowers and chainsaws. >Fuel storage is complicated (you will need 30+ gallons a day, or about 2 sedan tank’s worth. You put it in containers and put them in your garage. >Connecting to your panel is expensive at least $2k+. You don't have to do that. Just run some extension cords through your house. > They are smelly and noisy. So is everyone after a couple of days in the South without air conditioning! > And if it’s a real emergency, everyone will know you have one , and eventually come knocking. This is a feature, not a bug. It's how communities take care of each other. | |
| ▲ | nancyminusone a day ago | parent | prev [-] | | What are you running that uses 30+ gallons of gasoline per day? Personal AI datacenter? I barely use that much in my car per month. You should be able to expect at least 4-6kwh per gallon at the generator output. So $25 worth of gas in a 5 gallon can stores 5x the energy of a $2000 battery. The only maintenance I've done on my generator is to drain the fuel lines after use. Maybe change the engine oil once or twice per decade. Apart from that, it runs just as well as 30 years ago when it was new. True, the gasoline doesn't last that long in storage, but I just use it to fill my car every now and then, and get new gas. | | |
| ▲ | tonymet a day ago | parent [-] | | What’s your point? How long are you getting on 5 gallons? Maybe 10 hours if you’re lucky. And I hope you’re not using your 30 year old generator on anything with an IC – the power is too dirty to use with electronics. deferring the maintenance is your choice, but I wouldn’t recommend it. |
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| sure we can quibble over convenience, but it's an outage, and you have to make it work. Look at the testing for the Anker Solix S2000 they are getting 2+ days of regular refrigerator use , which is what people care about primarily . What other option is easier or more affordable? A generator has to remain outside, so it needs panel connection ($$) , lots of extensions ( $, hassle), needs a generous fuel supply, and regular maintenance. And plug-in solar is becoming legal in the usa. within 3 years everyone will be running these little things, and you'll come around. |
