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gkbrk 4 hours ago

If the model cannot figure out simple and ubiquitous tools, how is it supposed to figure out complex problems? All of the good models basically work with any harness, including giving them a single "shell command" tool. They can just figure things out.

hadlock 4 hours ago | parent | next [-]

When it comes to quality of outcome, since at least Feburary, the harness has almost equal, if not more weight than the model itself. It's no longer "which model is the best?" it's "which model + harness is the best?"

I get drastically different tool call failure rates using Claude SDK vs OpenCode using Qwen 3.6 models

RideOnTime22 9 minutes ago | parent | next [-]

Every other week it's a new "X didn't matter, until Y date" without any hard quantitative claims.

It's crazy how over the past years a field originating from math ends up succumbing to subjective feels.

JLO64 4 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

It's worth nothing that recent Claude models seem to have gotten worse at tool calling outside of Claude Code and the SDK: https://lucumr.pocoo.org/2026/7/4/better-models-worse-tools/

KronisLV 4 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

> the harness has almost equal, if not more weight than the model itself

This feels like a horrible failing of the models to generalize, then - both basic and intermediate tasks should be possible to do with Claude Code, OpenCode, Pi, ZCode, Kimi Code, Dirac and tbh any other mainstream or even slightly niche harness. Not doubting the claim itself, there's a reason why good benchmarks include the harness.

dominotw 2 hours ago | parent [-]

i think thats BS that harness has equal weight. most of intellegice is still coming from training data not from RL. so how is 'coevolved harness' equal weight.

HDBaseT 27 minutes ago | parent | prev | next [-]

Yeah this is a complete lie.

You can use effectively any harness and get good results. Harnesses are mostly placebo.

davidlt 4 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

I just wanted to emphasize this. Harness is a big part of how things perform thus usually it's harness + model co-design that's important.

azinman2 4 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

Which works better for you?

npn 4 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

I don't think so. there is a lot of tools with similar usage, some harness even bring their own internal tools for accurately manipulation.

also, even if some models claim that they have full 1M context window, some only work effective with the head or tail of the window, a proper harness tool will know about the limitation of the model and act accordingly.

then also the output format, the tool calling syntax, the quirks and gotchas of each model.

it is not simple as just throwing everything at the model, especially when your project has hundred of files or so.

derefr 4 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

Because complex problems can be decomposed (a skill in itself) into easy parts and hard parts; and the hard parts are almost always bottlenecked on understanding concepts and principles (i.e. things that are either in a model's weights, or not), not on having certain facts available. Models can solve complex problems insofar as they can decompose those problems, and have learned the concepts and principles relevant to approaching the hard parts of those problems.

Whereas tool-use isn't a capability problem, but a context problem: the thing that makes models fail by default is that they have no idea, when first summoned out of the aether, what kind of conversation they're having, who it's with, what that person is trying to do, what tools they have available, and how those tools can be invoked.

Think of the difference between how you'd respond to a casual programming question asked by a person sitting next to you on a flight, vs. a programming question asked of you by someone you're pair-programming with with your IDE open in front of you. Now imagine waking up blind and deaf and needing to discern which of the two situations you're in. LLMs know how to approach both of these problem-contexts (and more besides), but they need to be given context to know which problem-context they're in (and everything else about that problem-context: which IDE they're using, which OS it's installed on, what other tools are installed+accessible, etc.)

And before you say "but why can't they just experiment to figure these things out" — if you think about it, knowing how to interface with a shell and an IDE are bootstrapping requirements for any kind of experimentation, in about the same way that "knowing how to open your eyes and move your head" is a bootstrap requirement for a human gaining information about the world around them. These capabilities are necessary to explore the world to "discover" and "probe" other capabilities.

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Also, a lot of the work LLMs do "needs" (i.e. is heavily improved by the use of) some kind of structured scratchpad, that they have been trained to manipulate and "look at" through tool-use. Even for a human who could accurately visualize a canvas based on a coordinate system, you still wouldn't expect said human to succeed at the pelican test if they had to write the SVG entirely in their head and then write it out sequentially with no rewinding to fix mistakes. You'd expect them to ask for at least a whiteboard, if not a text editor, to be able to write and rewrite the SVG XML.

(Really, they'd ideally want to run the SVG and look at it to see how close it is, and optimize that way. I'm not sure if we're letting LLMs do that part in the classical pelican test. It feels like that would vaguely violate the "zero-shot"-ness of the test, though I'm not sure if we're currently considering a conversation to be "zero-shot" if it involves the model iteratively interacting with a third-party system [such that there are repeated model -> system -> model conversation turns] but holding off to responding to the user until they think they've fully solved the problem.)

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And also, on a lower level, all of these external capabilities are getting exposed to the LLM through MCP. Models can and do understand how to speak MCP itself. But there's no standard for how a given harness's capabilities (e.g. "execute command line in new shell session", "send patch edit command to active tab in IDE", etc) should be modelled to be exposed through MCP, either in their encoding or in their semantics. There's no MCP equivalent of WASM's WASI meta-standard, such that models could learn these specs and "assume by default" that things work like them until told otherwise; and nor are there even open harnesses that LLMs could learn about during training, and through them, learn some de-facto MCP-endpoint specs. Instead, there are mostly just proprietary harnesses, that hide all that info from public access, sharing it only with the LLM during inference, and even then, only at the moment the LLM needs it.

segmondy 3 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

the single shell command is the terminal bench.

sheeshkebab 4 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

This. The same goes for “skills”, skill type “subagents” and other bullshit - powerful models don’t need any of that anymore I noticed.

bugglebeetle 4 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

Not exactly. See:

https://alexzhang13.github.io/blog/2026/mgh/