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jmyeet 2 hours ago

As everyone should know by now, the US government runs a massive deficit, that is the difference between tax receipts (and other income) minus expenses. The current US public debt is hovering around $40T and the annual deficit is pushing toards $2T.

A lot of that $40T was borrowed at lower interest rates but let's assume for argument's sake that it was borrowed at 5%. That's $2T in interest alone every year. There's a huge difference between adding $2T in debt at 5%+ every year vs 1-3%.

The Fed has auctions to sell its debt. That market clears at a certain interest rate so if the market isn't buying the debt the rate the Fed pays has to go up. That's what's happening here.

What's driving this is that inflation is above the ~2% target. Well above, actually. There are generally two ways of tackling high inflation: with monetary policy (ie raising interest rates) and with fiscal policy (by raising taxes). Modern US administrations (both parties) have completely abandoned any pretense of ever raising taxes. That was the appropriate solution during the inflation shock of 2020-2022. Some European countries did this with a corporate windfall profits tax (eg Spain). The US did not.

The problem is that since housing is such a huge part of consumer spending, higher interest rates mean higher mortgage rates, which means higher housing expenditure, which means higher inflation. Now luckily most mortgages in the US are 30 year fixed so this is slow to respond and only really affects new mortgage. Other countries aren't so lucky.

But the big drivers in inflation are soaring grocery costs and energy costs. Energy costs, particularly diesel, is a massive driver of inflation. The rise in groceries since Covid has completley outpaced inflation while real wages have fallen. There's only so much more inflation the American consumer can take. Household savings rates are already very low so there's very little in the way of a buffer to absorb higher costs.

This is all being exacerbated by the disastrous war in Iran and the war in Ukraine. Russia had been a net exporter of diesel until recently as Ukraine has damaged an estimated 40% of Russian refining capcity. Refineries in the Gulf have also been taken offline. There's been a loss of over 1 million barrels per day in refining capacity. This is somewhat paradoxically why crudel oil prices are relatively low given all that's going on: because crudel oil is mostly useless unless it's refined. Destroy refineries and demand for oil goes down. But the demand for refined petroleum products goes up, way up [1].

It should be noted that China has essentially saved the world economy up to this point [2]. The closure of the Strait of Hormuz blocked the passage of ~20 million barrels per day of crude (plus 20-30% of the world's natural gas plus fertilizer plus helium). The inflation shock of 2020-2022 occurred because we lost "only" 10 million barrels. But China seemingly cut their imports by 5M. Saudi Arabia diverted 5-7 via the East-West pipeline to the Red Sea. The US has been draining the strategic reserve and so net we've only lost a few million barrels per day. That's temporary. the SPR has hit historic lows not seen in 40 years and it can't get much lower without risking a collapse of the salt caverns it's stroed in in Louisiana. Nobody knows if and when that'll happen because we've never done this before.

The backdrop for all this is that there has been a decades-long effort at this point to essentially loot government coffers in the US. More tax cuts for the top 0.01%. The Western world in general has reached a breaking point where land hoarding and wealth need to be taxed or society as we know it will actually break down. I'm not being hyperbolic. Currently, there's no concern for that from the looters because upheaval means war, which means more weapons sales. Also, free movement of capital means the wealthy believe they can just flee.

For context, a mere 10 years ago the US total public debt was ~$16T. It's 2.5x'ed in a decade and only going to get worse unless something drastically changes.

Warsh was put in to cut rates for political purposes. The best he can do is to hold rates steady because they really should go up in an environment where we aren't going to raise taxes.

As for Iran, it's been clear since at least April, that this is an unmistakable and undeniable total strategic defeat for the US and there is no way out other than to surrender. This event will be written about in history books as a turning point in the world order that was designed by the US, for the US after 1945. We are entering a new era. This is going to redefine US relationships all over the world.

[1]: https://rbnenergy.com/market-data/3-2-1-crack-spread

[2]: https://www.theatlantic.com/economy/2026/07/china-iran-usa-o...

Panzer04 an hour ago | parent | next [-]

American fixed 30y mortgages actually make interest rate policy much less effective, in theory.

In most countries with normal mortgages, raising rates fairly immediately transmits through to the rest of the economy, because it affects the mortgage market. This isn't true in America, because everyone quite reasonably is able to get these insane mortgage products with literally no downside risk - if rates go up, you don't pay more. If they go down, you refinance at minimal cost.

Agree to disagree on the tax issue. The way you've framed it is fairly inflammatory, but happy to have a discussion about it. The reality is that as much money as rich people have, the middle class have a whole lot more. Every country with large government spending has broad, high taxes on the entire population, not just the rich.

fjfaase 33 minutes ago | parent | next [-]

This is not uniquely American. Here in the Netherlands we also have fixed interest rates for long periods. Usually for 20 years.

avmich an hour ago | parent | prev [-]

So you don't buy the POV the middle class is squeezed out of existence, almost?

dlcarrier 37 minutes ago | parent | prev | next [-]

Don't overlook quantitative easing. Introducing more money into a monetary system has a significant inflationary effect on the money that was already present.

Also, housing costs don't statically climb as interest rates go up. A decrease in market price makes up for most of the difference.

orsenthil an hour ago | parent | prev | next [-]

The interesting thing is, US media, US social media driven by Big Tech algorithms, Google Search, nytimes, reddit, Social newsfeeds of students, teens, teachers is not exposing this at all. It feels like we are self-contained information exposure bubble too. Only a physical visit outside of US, and looking at the information from outside of US will give a picture of the mistakes being made here.

eunos 43 minutes ago | parent | prev | next [-]

China should increase the import pace especially after the US strategic reserve depleted. Considering that despite Chinese saving, US and EU are more interested doing another trade war.

deepsun an hour ago | parent | prev | next [-]

> This is all being exacerbated by the disastrous war in Iran

No, why? US is an exporter, not importer of oil, so any price increase of crude oil is good for US. Maybe not consumers, but government (Venezuela had literal amine while exporting a lot of oil and honoring all of the international debt payments). So US must have more money to service its international debt.

RealityVoid 24 minutes ago | parent | next [-]

What happens to the local price of oil if you are able to export the oil at a much higher price?

nonethewiser 4 minutes ago | parent [-]

[dead]

enraged_camel 40 minutes ago | parent | prev [-]

>> US is an exporter, not importer of oil, so any price increase of crude oil is good for US.

It is good for US oil producers, who have indeed been making money hand over fist exporting oil at a premium. It certainly it not good for anyone else.

cjs_ac an hour ago | parent | prev | next [-]

Adding to this, US foreign and military policy is increasingly chaotic, so other countries are quietly disengaging, and tariffs are slowly unravelling the US’ trade relationships. The American people voted for Trump twice: Trumpism is now an established thread in US politics, and the rest of the world is taking steps to insulate itself from the coming turmoil.

seizethecheese an hour ago | parent [-]

You’re right about a lot of this but there’s no evidence of trade slowing down. US exports are actually accelerating https://fred.stlouisfed.org/series/IEAXGS

bayarearefugee 2 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

And somehow this situation is all Joe Biden's fault, and Trump is still going to fix it, any day now.

A very significant amount of American voters believe this. To this day. And their belief in this is still being reinforced by the vast majority of the "mainstream media" which they believe is left-biased, which hasn't been true for very many years at this point.

This is why we are fucked and there is no way out of this that doesn't involve existential threat to our current society.

jmyeet 2 hours ago | parent | next [-]

I understand the point you're making about blind devotion to Trump but the reality is that Biden is not free from blame here, in four ways:

1. Trump in his first term created the Abraham Accords that directly contributed to the genocide that has since happened (by excluding Palestinians from the process). Biden did not reverse any of that because he is an avowed Zionist;

2. Trump blew up the JCPOA that sought to include Iran in the international community for really no reason than to please his donors, particularly his biggest donors, Sheldon and Miriam Adelson, who are also avowed Zionists. This was an Obama-era deal and part of me is convinced that Trump blew it up simply because it had Obama's name on it. Biden of course did not reinstate it;

3. Trump blew up energy markets in 2020 with the disastrous OPEC deal he made in June that created the inflation shock of Covid. Biden quietly went to MBS to get him to increase oil output. He refused. Biden said nothing. He absolutely could've waved a very big stick to get MBS to change course here, notably by threatening arms shipments; and

4. The so-called "bear-hug strategy" following October 7 set the stage for everything that's happening now. At any point in the last more than a year of his term, Biden could've ended that conflict with a phone call. He did not because, again, he is an avowed Zionist. That both emboldened Israel to drag the US into the Iran war and also was a key factor in the Democrats losing the 2024 presidential election although I'm not actually convinced we'd be in a vastly different situation had Kamala won (eg [1]).

US foreign policy is surprisingly uniparty.

Oil is good for business because it's good for war. It's also why we don't have major investment in renewables. As this article put it, nobody goes to war over a solar panel [2].

[1]: https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2024/10/8/kamala-harris-says-...

[2]: https://www.theenergymix.com/no-one-goes-to-war-over-a-solar...

jmward01 an hour ago | parent | next [-]

No comment on the points you made, but thanks for the article No One Goes to War Over a Solar Panel' was a good read.

itake 24 minutes ago | parent | prev | next [-]

On JCPOA, many of the critical provisions had pending expiration dates by this time [0] [1] and re-negotiation needed to happen again anyways.

Obama kicked the can down the road and Trump/Biden needed to provide the next kick.

[0] - Jan 2026, the limits on the types of centrifuges expire. Jan 2031, quantitative nuclear limits expire (enrichment ceiling).

[1] - https://www.armscontrol.org/act/2017-10/news/iran-nuclear-de...

bayarearefugee an hour ago | parent | prev | next [-]

Oh, I'm not exactly a huge Joe Biden fan. I just think it is ridiculous that nobody "on the right" calls Trump on using him as a universal scapegoat for everything as we continue to fumble into an economic situation that Trump is consistently actively making worse.

I think Biden did manage to enact some good domestic economic policy in a tough political environment, but in addition to everything you pointed out that I agree with he obviously should have stepped aside for the 2024 election long before he did and his decision to nominate Merrick Garland for Attorney General will be seen as one of those history book moments of very high consequence in the fall of an empire (assuming we have legitimate history books in this future).

Plenty of blame to go around for many Democrats here for both the fact that our disastrous foreign policy is, as you've said, uniparty, and also their fecklessness and early boosting of the whole Trump project in 2016 (because they believed he would be easier to beat than the other Republicans) did a lot to set all of this in motion.

nikau an hour ago | parent | prev | next [-]

I can't understand the logic behind party A did something, and then blame party B for not undoing it.

Not everything is a simple ctrl-z, and the blame lays squarely on who implemented it.

lowbloodsugar an hour ago | parent [-]

A mugger stabs your friend and runs off. They are bleeding out. You do nothing. That’s what he’s saying. The fact is Biden did nothing to prevent this. Including not locking the fucker up. Not stacking the Supreme Court after the Ginsberg shitshow.

mittensc 24 minutes ago | parent | next [-]

> They are bleeding out. You do nothing

There are a lot of people that do not know what to do.

There are also wounds that you can't really do anything about without hospital. (internal bleeding?!)

The funny thing is, as analogies go, here the friend tells you to bugger off because of israel and tells the mugger to come back and help him... mugger stabs him some more

itake 19 minutes ago | parent | prev [-]

I hear you, but I really don't want the government flip flopping every 4-8 years on policy.

"stuck in the past" vibes vs making progress

rexpop 28 minutes ago | parent | prev | next [-]

How is this not a total nonsequitur from the parent thread??

UltraSane an hour ago | parent | prev | next [-]

"he is an avowed Zionist"

What exactly do you mean when you say Zionist?

ryanwhitney an hour ago | parent [-]

I believe they're referring to when Joe Biden said "I am a Zionist."

UltraSane 34 minutes ago | parent [-]

What did he mean then? Israel exists as a Jewish state so I really don't know what people mean when they say it.

Cyph0n 18 minutes ago | parent | prev | next [-]

Your analysis will be downvoted, but it is absolutely spot on. One day, everyone will always have been against this.

lovich an hour ago | parent | prev [-]

> At any point in the last more than a year of his term, Biden could've ended that conflict with a phone call. He did not because, again, he is an avowed Zionist.

No he could not have. Israel has been a contentious ally for the US, especially while a Democrat has been POTUS because they are actually independently capable of supporting themselves and have their own internal economy and military industrial complex.

The relationship between the United States and Israel started with us(The United States) peeling them off of USSR support in the late 60s[1], and if we abandon them they will either go it on their own or find another ally who has interests in the region due to oil still being important.

Biden as a representative of the United States had leverage over Israel, but not such complete control that he could just call Netanyahu and demand and end the war and have that be done with.

And that's not even getting into whatever the fuck you mean by " ... he is an avowed Zionist" [1]https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Soviet_Union_and_the_Arab%E2%8...

Cyph0n 21 minutes ago | parent [-]

You can argue all day long, but at the end of the day, the US has immense ability to exert pressure on Israel, starting with withholding UNSC vetoes.

The Biden admin pulled no levers whatsoever. On the contrary, it went to great lengths to cover for a genocide that it was aware of. This admin will be part of the history books, but not in a good light :)

lovich 14 minutes ago | parent [-]

> ... US has immense ability to exert pressure on Israel, starting with withholding UNSC vetoes.

You are 100% correct on this. That does not however mean they have the ability to end a war in one phone call

> The Biden admin pulled no levers whatsoever.

This is incorrect. Biden tried to constrain Netanyahu and did shit like making the pier to deliver aid to the Palestinians. Netanyahu responded by snubbing Biden and giving a speech to the Senate instead.

I am generally anti Israel as the nation because I believe they have been a shit tier ally who feels free to fuck around in our elections with no remorse, but acting like we had the ability to force them into actions they didn't want, without using military force, is fucking ridiculous.

Again, I think they are a piss poor ally, largely because they will not work with us, and that is largely because they have the ability to operate independently and utilize that ability constantly. If we got rid of any dependence on oil I would say fuck the whole region because every state there is in a competition over who can be the biggest assholes to use, with the possible slight exception of Jordan, and I cage that claim because I only know a decade or two of their history in relations with us and honestly mostly because one of their kings wanted to be in star trek so bad he got a spot as an extra, which implies some level of agreeing with our values.

thrwaway55 2 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

[flagged]

CamelCaseName 2 hours ago | parent | next [-]

This is low quality flamebait.

lovich an hour ago | parent [-]

the account is named with throwaway misspelled in the name, he's mocking anyone who interacts with him. Just flag and move on so these assholes don't get more engagement.

kkotak 2 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

You're in luck then. Enjoy the ride.

Der_Einzige 2 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

If no one had tried to shoot Trump and he stayed as as he was in his first term, he'd be the "sleepy" one. This is an actual quote from Trump circa 2016. His rage at his trial and attempt assassinations gave him 10 extra years of relative energy:

"Look, having nuclear — my uncle was a great professor and scientist and engineer, Dr. John Trump at MIT; good genes, very good genes, OK, very smart, the Wharton School of Finance, very good, very smart — you know, if you're a conservative Republican, if I were a liberal, if, like, OK, if I ran as a liberal Democrat, they would say I'm one of the smartest people anywhere in the world — it's true! — but when you're a conservative Republican they try — oh, do they do a number — that's why I always start off: Went to Wharton, was a good student, went there, went there, did this, built a fortune — you know I have to give my like credentials all the time, because we're a little disadvantaged — but you look at the nuclear deal, the thing that really bothers me — it would have been so easy, and it's not as important as these lives are — nuclear is so powerful; my uncle explained that to me many, many years ago, the power and that was 35 years ago; he would explain the power of what's going to happen and he was right, who would have thought? — but when you look at what's going on with the four prisoners — now it used to be three, now it's four — but when it was three and even now, I would have said it's all in the messenger; fellas, and it is fellas because, you know, they don't, they haven't figured that the women are smarter right now than the men, so, you know, it's gonna take them about another 150 years — but the Persians are great negotiators, the Iranians are great negotiators, so, and they, they just killed, they just killed us, this is horrible."

twostorytower an hour ago | parent | prev | next [-]

Believe it or not...calls.

lowbloodsugar an hour ago | parent | prev | next [-]

Higher interest rates mean buyers can afford less house for the money. House prices go down. Boomers get mad.

avmich an hour ago | parent [-]

You're sure house prices are elastic here?

matwood an hour ago | parent [-]

They are slowly elastic. The only way to speed up the re-pricing is a recession where people lose their jobs and are forced to sell. Otherwise, it's mainly young people entering their first house phase that get impacted - which is exactly what we've seen.

gritzko an hour ago | parent | prev | next [-]

"crudel oil"?

abtinf an hour ago | parent | prev [-]

> There are generally two ways of tackling high inflation: with monetary policy (ie raising interest rates) and with fiscal policy (by raising taxes).

While this is the orthodoxy, it should be obvious it is nonsense.

The idea that we must curtail production in order to reduce inflation is so incoherent that it damns the professional court economists who have spread it far and wide.