How many children, actually have the money to buy themself another smartphone, or get a smartphone gifted by random people? I bet that's very rare.

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Zak 6 hours ago | parent | next [-]

The commercial value of a ten year old smartphone in a wealthy country is approximately $0. It's probably not terribly hard for a determined child who goes to school and has friends to obtain one.

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johnnyanmac 6 hours ago | parent [-]

And I bet I'd struggle to install almost all modern popular apps on a 10 year old phone. No Youtube, no Roblox, etc. They simply wouldn't update nor connect. That's one problem solved by the fact that phones operate on a deprecation model, as opposed to Windows OS.

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epihelix 3 hours ago | parent | next [-]

I'm writing this on a seven year old phone (an S10e), running a community ROM with A15, and I have no issues at all in installing any apps. This device is my daily driver (it has a headphone jack and SD card support, and a relatively easily replaceable battery, and is small and light - so it's better than most modern flagships for my needs). A pixel would have much better community ROM support still. These old flagship phones are still plenty powerful for anything other than (useless) on device AI or intense 3D gaming.

There is only a "depreciation" model if you don't unlock your bootloader - and even then, a seven year support cycle makes it very easy to obtain cheap, old, fully supported phones, if that's your jam.

	▲	johnnyanmac 2 hours ago \| parent [-]
		>There is only a "depreciation" model if you don't unlock your bootloader That's fair. I also think most kids won't know how to unlock a bootloader (and if Google has its way, that won't be an option anyway). > a seven year support cycle makes it very easy to obtain cheap, old, fully supported phones, if that's your jam. Is that iphone support? I think only the biggest flagships get 7 years of official support (and can maybe run 2-3 more years before app version itself out, without external intervention). From what I saw, most budget phones are lucky to get 5 years of support, and will break down well before than anyways.

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Zak 5 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

That may be, but quite a few of the things that people want to keep kids out of are entirely usable from a browser.

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mrtksn 8 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

In real life, it doesn't work like this for most people. In real life, kids want something and either the parents agree to buy that and then they no longer bother with that device or the kid saves its money trades something and get that device.

The idea that a kid gets an expensive device that can't buy by itself and the parents have control or what device the kid gets is a very middle-class assumption. Life isn't that perfect for most people.

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johnnyanmac 6 hours ago | parent [-]

With all due respect, this just sounds like justification for lazy parenting. We're 2 generations into the digital era: parents of such an era should have enough digital literacy to make sure their kids do not get in danger.

Let's use another analog: Kids want sweets and parents either agree to buy that and no longer bother with their diet, or saves money to go to the candy store. Yet if a kid gets too unhealthy we (IMO, rightfully) have CPS sent to their house to investigate their home life.

Kids were never meant to be a convenience. And parents talked about here aren't rich enough to delegate their parenting off to someone else. Take a few hours to research what you give to your kid and monitor what they might get outside of your vision.

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subscribed 5 hours ago | parent [-]

It's okay that it doesn't match your experience but it's also a case that you shouldn't extrapolate your expectations and experience onto others.

There's plenty of overworked, stressed or ignorant parents who really wish they could care or they don't at all.

"should have enough digital literacy" doesn't survive reality check - reportedly 12-26% adults in the UK (% depending on the country) is reported to have very poor/lack of basic literacy skills. 25% approximately are functionally illiterate.

Reportedly (I'm not an American), 36 million of US adults are functionally illiterate; 43% cannot read a simple job application; 41% of low-income households lack digital literacy skills.

Those are only two prominent examples. More developed countries (especially in Europe) will fare better, many countries will fare much worse.

I think your heart is in the right place but the reality stays in disagreement.

	▲	johnnyanmac 2 hours ago \| parent [-]
		Maybe it's a cultural issue here, but my country is very resistant to the government coming in to course correct how people live their lives. Many times to its detriment (diet, guns, social media), but the boon of this is that it makes it really hard for anyone to incorporate a surveillance state. "Those who sacrifice freedom for security..." And all that. The sad fact is many kids are already falling under the cracks. Failing to mind their kids internet usage is just one way, and having companies sneak in to try and fix this patch won't suddenly lead to success. The needle won't be moved in terms of progress, but privacy will take a near fatal blow. I fail to see why we should accept such measures when this is just yet another bald face power grab by greedy corporations. I might have been more accommodating if this was in good faith, but we've been past the BOTD for at least 7 years now.

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mrguyorama 7 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

Walmart has sold android smartphones of okay functionality that poor people depend on for decades.

Like, less than $100. Nowadays they have $20 ones that are locked to pay as you go monthly purchases, which is definitely worse than the old tracfone days but about the same price if you had to top up every month anyway. That's ignoring used phones.

Even poor kids get christmas money sometimes.