Yes I thought this was the standard solution?

People have been doing this since way back in the TrueCrypt days - IIRC you could configure it to run a whole fake version of Windows if you wanted without easily revealing your actual main volume.

Most hardware crypto wallets also have a "duress wallet" feature where you keep a low balance for the same reason.

Wiping is obviously extremely suspicious and asking for trouble

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jjbinx007 8 hours ago | parent | next [-]

"Wiping is obviously extremely suspicious and asking for trouble"

It's sad this is the default view. It's his device, his data, his life on that phone. If he had wiped the phone before the interrogation it wouldn't be a problem. How long before? A second before? A week before? But wiping the data a minute later is suddenly asking for trouble.

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ifwinterco 7 hours ago | parent | next [-]

I don't like it and I wish we had more privacy, but realistically there is no such "right".

If you're going to be in a situation where you're in a room with some goons backed by the full power of the state, it is what it is.

Maybe because I'm not American I don't have any hangups about seeing the US government this way, but my own government is no different - you can (and people have) get stopped at Heathrow, taken to a dimly lit backroom and given a going over for hours

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schoen 7 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

I don't know that there is case law on this but I imagine that "prior to the admissibility inspection" is likely to be treated differently from "during the admissibility inspection" or "during administrative detention or secondary inspection" (or "in response to a request or question by a border agent"!).

Edit: a bigger picture question is the difference between things that may be legally punishable and things that may cause suspicion from CBP agents, which aren't the same thing at all.

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bryanrasmussen 6 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

it seems to me that if you give them a password to unlock the phone and when it unlocks it has been wiped that will cause problems whether it is the password that causes the wiping or not?

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Zak 4 hours ago | parent [-]

A US citizen has an almost unlimited right to enter the USA. The border search rule permits officials to search for things that are illegal to import. A blank phone is not illegal to import.

A non-citizen who arrives with a blank phone might be denied entry because it seems suspicious.

	▲	bryanrasmussen 4 hours ago \| parent [-]
		well OK, luckily my checking of media informs me no citizens have been stopped and held in custody by immigration without due process or any particular grounds, especially recently, so it all sounds good.

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7 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

[deleted]

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schoen 7 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

We noted in the border search guide that lying to the agents in response to their questions is potentially a crime in its own right (even if it's not done in order to hide anything illegal). We thought that this made hidden volumes quite tricky, particularly if one's intent was to pretend to comply with a question or request while actually not complying.

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mrandish 7 hours ago | parent [-]

IANAL but I think while lying to some questions might lead to obstruction charges, not answering is simply exercising the right to remain silent.

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tsimionescu 6 hours ago | parent [-]

Sure - but the point is, if you're instructed by the officer to enter a password so they can inspect your device, and you enter a fake password and show them a fake version of your data, that could easily be found later to constitute a lie and lead to serious legal trouble.

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withinboredom 6 hours ago | parent [-]

I'm pretty sure they can't compel you to enter a password.

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tsimionescu 5 hours ago | parent | next [-]

They can't compel you, no. However, they can ask you to do so, and if you enter a privacy password that shows them something other than your real device (which is what this thread was about), you can very likely be faced with charges of obstruction of justice or even perjury. The point was that it's better to simply refuse, and accept the consequences of that, rather than trying to use technical means to trick them or to wipe data.

Note that if you're not a citizen of the USA, refusing to comply with a request like this is very likely to have you sent back to your country and denied access to the USA forever. While they can't legally force you to comply, they can absolutely deny you entry for any reason like this, regardless of having a valid visa and everything else in order. This even applies to legal residents.

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inigyou 4 hours ago | parent [-]

How would they discover you entered a wrong password?

	▲	tsimionescu 3 hours ago \| parent [-]
		If you want to gamble on that, that's your prerogative. But if they suspect you did this, computer forensics techniques can easily reveal this, especially if the rest of the data on the device is recoverable to you as well. Edit to add: beyond forensics, they can also simply ask you to enter the other password, to prove that the account you showed them first was the right one.

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actionfromafar 5 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

They can't, but that will put you in another "suspicious" bucket.