| ▲ | ozgung 2 hours ago | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
Everyone is talking about banning Chinese models but nobody talks how it is feasible to ban them. I think it’s impossible simply because technically there is no such thing as a “Chinese model”. There is no way to tell apart an “American” model from a “Chinese” one by looking at their weights. Weights are just numbers and you can’t assign country of origin to numbers. One can find very easy workarounds to any naive attempt to ban them by origin. So, any solution to this “problem” must include ALL open-weight models. As far as I understand this is exactly what they intend to do. Axios article linked in the post mentions that. As in this quote: “The source described leading AI labs or their allies approaching the administration every 3-5 months with an idea to ban open-source models.” It doesn’t say “Chinese” open-source models. Because they already know that it’s not feasible. Any regulation must cover all the models. Now there are solutions for that latter problem. But they are all ugly and restrictive. Making a DRM-like license protection system mandatory can be a solution. If a company wants to run an open model in their own servers, they can only use approved and certified pure “American” models. This of course creates a monopoly for the big labs who are authorized to train and distribute such “open” models. A company can fine-tune the model for its own needs but of course can’t distribute the derivative model. I’m sure there are other solutions but all of them would be equally ugly. Also these regulations can’t be enforced to other countries easily so only Americans will be restricted. | ||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
| ▲ | satvikpendem 42 minutes ago | parent | next [-] | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
It's simple, the US government will put any Chinese open model companies on the entity list which blocks any company which does business with the US from also doing business with the Chinese companies. This creates a chilling effect where even if it may be harder to tell, no US company will be able to provide or use any overt Chinese open model and won't even risk trying to go around as the punishments for trying to evade the ban are severe. | ||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
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| ▲ | kloop 2 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-] | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
> “The source described leading AI labs or their allies approaching the administration every 3-5 months with an idea to ban open-source models.” That's going to hit first amendment grounds pretty quick, the same way that software in general did. The modern version of the decss flag will be a character that says "I think good weights are {...weights go here...}" They could, however, ban any payment to a chinese entity, or any entity owned by a chinese entity for inference/ai services/etc | ||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
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| ▲ | bfung an hour ago | parent | prev | next [-] | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
It’s not really feasible, in my opinion. US Gov could make US companies comply, like have Huggingface take down models out of compliance. But most likely, a foreign-to-US Huggingface replacement would be made and everyone would go there instead. Lose-lose for US. | ||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
| ▲ | rvz 16 minutes ago | parent | prev | next [-] | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
> Everyone is talking about banning Chinese models but nobody talks how it is feasible to ban them. It is not possible to 100% ban open weight models getting released in the same way you cannot stop leaks. Just ask Meta with the original Llama leak. | ||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
| ▲ | PunchyHamster 2 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-] | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
It would basically make America behind as every other country would use open, cheaper models for all tasks but the ones requiring frontier models. And that list of tasks grows smaller every day > Everyone is talking about banning Chinese models but nobody talks how it is feasible to ban them. I think it’s impossible simply because technically there is no such thing as a “Chinese model”. There is no way to tell apart an “American” model from a “Chinese” one by looking at their weights. Weights are just numbers and you can’t assign country of origin to numbers. One can find very easy workarounds to any naive attempt to ban them by origin. Historically just asking it about tianment square or getting some random answers turn into chinese (as latest interation of online deepseek likes to do recently) is enough > Now there are solutions for that latter problem. But they are all ugly and restrictive. Making a DRM-like license protection system mandatory can be a solution. I am very worried that's where consumer hardware will go to. All so AI companies can license local use of their stuff, and once that happens, less of an incentive to even have model be open. Possibly even have DRM that counts number of computation done per model in pay per use model | ||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
| ▲ | marsven_422 an hour ago | parent | prev | next [-] | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
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| ▲ | rullopat an hour ago | parent | prev [-] | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
You need to ask what happened in Tienanmen square | ||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
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