| ▲ | wisty a day ago |
| AI pessimist view. Even if AI gets smarter it will still be agreeable, and people will use it to more confidently reinforce thier stupider ideas, especially in areas where they lack the knowledge to know if they are right. Even if this can be solved, technically, people won't want to use the model that says they are wrong, so they will choose the glib lies that reinforce their beliefs. Freedown of speech forces people to think they may be wrong, but freedom of association lets people avoid this. AI is going to be internet hug box echo chambers at an unbelievable scale. |
|
| ▲ | tithe a day ago | parent | next [-] |
| Henry Petroski in "To Engineer is Human" has a chapter about the advent of the calculator during the slide rule era, and that calculators (and later computers) eroded a structural engineer's "feel for the numbers", caused engineers to pursue work on the fringe of their abilities, and perhaps more seriously, limited their ability to verify the correctness of the computer's work (this was the era where, for the first time, a machine could perform orders of magnitude calculations more quickly than humans could). He outlines the collapse of the Hartford Civic Center [1] as a case study in when blindly trusting computer output goes wrong (and by sheer luck, no one was killed). It feels like the example was cherry-picked, but the combination of "less accurate" and "more confident" made me immediately think of this disaster. I truly worry that it's going to take civilian deaths / liability before the proper use / place of these new technologies is adopted, but we could probably start with 1) not in safety critical systems, and 2) don't replace your specialists / experts with algorithms. [1] https://www.engr.psu.edu/ae/thesis/failures/MKP/failures/fai... |
|
| ▲ | GuB-42 a day ago | parent | prev | next [-] |
| More recent AI tends to be less agreeable, sycophancy is widely recognized as a problem and AI companies are working to fix it. And sure enough, some people don't like it, as shown when OpenAI shut down GPT-4o. But for the people who do actual work with AI, who are the people who pay a lot of money for it, they prefer to be called wrong when they are, because it is better to be called wrong by an AI than being wrong in front of a customer. It is not an easy problem to fix, because as much as we want an AI to give us the right answer rather than just being agreeable, we still need them to follow orders, and AI that doesn't would be quite useless. So there is a balance to be found. Smarter models tend to do better because they know what is right, compared to smaller models that don't and then assume you are right and hallucinate from there. |
|
| ▲ | baranul a day ago | parent | prev | next [-] |
| Agree. AI behavior, when interacting with humans, is based on making money. Making people feel uncomfortable or challenged, will usually not be the preferred business strategy. But, it would be interesting if people could easily select the AI's personality type or to what extent it can be adversarial to the comments or ideas given as input. |
| |
| ▲ | iugtmkbdfil834 a day ago | parent [-] | | I mean, technically they can by requesting it. But the reality is that those custom changes only last so long unless you effectively open with them at every session start. And some people do that. Until recent gpt changes, I was largely relying on context and saved 'memories' and keywords, but recent updates made it less reliable again. I do like the idea of AI personalities ( I actually use them a fair bit for varying opposing perspectives ), but I am not entirely certain people want that. |
|
|
| ▲ | sdfefcxv a day ago | parent | prev | next [-] |
| Im not mad about this. As someone who rarely uses LLMs because I dont need to, nor does it benefit me - I work on stuff that is original for which LLMs are useless at - Im glad. I want everyone around me to get dumb as hell. It makes my path in life much easier and more successful. |
| |
| ▲ | beering a day ago | parent | next [-] | | You really do not want to live in a world where people around you are as dumb as hell. You don’t want your car mechanic, your restaurant chef, your local traffic engineer to be dumb as hell because that only makes your life worse. Closer to you, you don’t want your customers, your coworkers, your friends, and your neighbors to be dumb as hell. Whatever you may gain by being the smartest one on your block is more than offset by the myriad ways in which dumb people make life worse. | |
| ▲ | talon8635 a day ago | parent | prev | next [-] | | Oh boy this couldn’t be more wrong. A society overtaken by ignorance does not value you, the self proclaimed genius. | | |
| ▲ | sdfefcxv 11 hours ago | parent [-] | | Explain Mark Zuckerberg - 'dumb fucks'. Thats the problem with this place - y'all think you are so smart. Haha. No. | | |
| ▲ | talon8635 11 hours ago | parent [-] | | Help me understand your question. I honestly can’t connect the dots. What do you mean re Zuck? |
|
| |
| ▲ | stevenhuang a day ago | parent | prev [-] | | What a maladaptive perspective. |
|
|
| ▲ | ColdStream a day ago | parent | prev | next [-] |
| Alas, a lot of people have always preferred a comfortable lie than an uncomfortable truth. |
|
| ▲ | emp17344 a day ago | parent | prev | next [-] |
| The solution is to stop treating AI as superhuman semi-living entities, as many boosters are apt to do. We can acknowledge it as a useful tool while understanding it has limits and is not “alive” or “thinking” in the same way a human is. |
| |
| ▲ | lll-o-lll a day ago | parent | next [-] | | That’s not a solution. Humans are wired to anthropomorphise; we do it with sticks and rocks. How much more so with LLMs. We’ve invented a technology that hijacks that part of humanity more effectively than anything ever. Asking people to “not be so stupid” is not going to help. | | |
| ▲ | mohamedkoubaa a day ago | parent | next [-] | | People who should know better do it too | |
| ▲ | emp17344 a day ago | parent | prev | next [-] | | The marketing and ecosystem surrounding these tools feeds into the anthropomorphization to a huge extent, though. You’re doing the opposite - throwing up your hands and going “it’s our evolutionary instinct, what can you do” while willfully ignoring how manipulated this space is. OpenAI alone has a higher advertising budget than Coca-Cola. | | |
| ▲ | mmooss a day ago | parent [-] | | > The marketing and ecosystem surrounding these tools feeds into the anthropomorphization to a huge extent And especially their design. The con artist politeness and confidence is not an accident of output, but a design choice by the developers. I tell non-technical people: It's a software program; there is always a person behind it, and they have consciously chosen this output, to serve their own interests. |
| |
| ▲ | cindyllm a day ago | parent | prev | next [-] | | [dead] | |
| ▲ | mmooss a day ago | parent | prev [-] | | Both claims seem to obviously contradict reality, imho: > Humans are wired to anthropomorphise; we do it with sticks and rocks. I do not see people anthropomorphize their TVs, books, paintings, cars, houses, rocks, sticks, ... I'm not sure what you're talking about here. I haven't seen someone call a rock or stick by a pronoun, for example. I've seen people fancifully do it, but it's exaggeration for a cute effect, and works because everyone knows they're exaggerating. > We’ve invented a technology that hijacks that part of humanity more effectively than anything ever. Asking people to “not be so stupid” is not going to help. People learn to look at things in different ways. Humans learn, society changes. It's changed quite a bit in recent years; it's much different than a century ago, a century before that, etc. In a way, it's more worship of technology to say humans are hopelessly, powerlessly dumb, and technology inevitably rules them. The inevitability of technology is of course a self-serving trope of the industry: you are powerless, we are inevitable. How convenient, and short-sighted. | | |
| ▲ | lll-o-lll a day ago | parent [-] | | I did not say that humans anthropomorphise every rock or stick. The point is that we are hard-wired for this possibility. Perhaps something more relatable? A cat? We ascribe all sorts of emotions to instinctive feline behaviours. It doesn’t matter with cats. > In a way, it's more worship of technology to say humans are hopelessly, powerlessly dumb, and technology inevitably rules them. You as an individual have some autonomy against the machines. Some. (Scroll facebook an hour a day and show me your resilience to engagement engineering). But the point of this is what happens at population scale. To ignore our biology is as stupid as suggesting we must be ruled by it. |
|
| |
| ▲ | palmotea a day ago | parent | prev | next [-] | | > The solution is to stop treating AI as superhuman semi-living entities, as many boosters are apt to do. It's not just fanboys doing that, but "official" educational channels. Both an internal training (more like an all-hands knowledge share) and some dumb training session by a guy from Anthropic explicitly, repeatedly recommended users anthropomorphize their chatbots on no uncertain terms. "Treat it as your super-smart coworkers", "I named mine Becky and I go to her with all my work challenges", etc. | | | |
| ▲ | crooked-v a day ago | parent | prev [-] | | What I'd like is the TNG ship computer: an extremely smart system that nonetheless limits its "creativity" to the clearly marked holodeck, where simple prompting is treated like the casual throwaway diversion it is, and actual authors are still putting in substantial effort and personal preferences and viewpoints into their work. |
|
|
| ▲ | alterom a day ago | parent | prev [-] |
| >. AI is going to be internet hug box echo chambers at an unbelievable scale. More like hotbox of one's own farts, but yeah |