| ▲ | stackghost 3 hours ago |
| Index funds, for starters. |
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| ▲ | tjwebbnorfolk 3 hours ago | parent | next [-] |
| Contrary to (apparently) popular opinion, index funds are not people. |
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| ▲ | rmunn 2 hours ago | parent | next [-] | | Correct. Index funds are owned by people. For example, I have invested a large chunk of my retirement savings in an S&P 500 indexed fund (as many, many other people do). Whatever stocks the S&P 500 list, are what I end up owning; if I don't want to own one of those, I have to either roll that money into a different fund (which IIRC has limits, can't do that too often without tax consequences) or take the money out (and pay a tax penalty for withdrawing it before retirement). So whether the index funds do or don't buy a certain stock has direct implications for real, non-millionaire, people. | |
| ▲ | moomin 2 hours ago | parent | prev [-] | | No, they're just owned by people. Most of whom aren't billionaires. |
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| ▲ | quickthrowman 3 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-] |
| I don’t even have access to a NASDAQ fund in my 401K. You have to go out of your way to buy the NASDAQ 100, QQQ and /NQ or /MNQ futures are the most popular instruments for getting exposure. I have a tiny minute slice of SPCX from owning VTI total market ETF but my 401K holds no SpaceX. |
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| ▲ | malfist 3 hours ago | parent | next [-] | | Okay? Just because you don't have access to that investment vehicle doesn't mean others aren't using it. What type of reasoning is this? "I, personally, am not too badly effected, therefore it's not a problem" And guess what, your VTI which does track NASDAQ as part of it's index is effected by this inclusion rule. | | |
| ▲ | danielmarkbruce 3 hours ago | parent [-] | | His reasoning is valid. Compared to the S&P500, it's a small sum of money. Most people aren't buying a fund that tracks that nasdaq index. The total effect isn't that large. | | |
| ▲ | malfist 2 hours ago | parent [-] | | His reasoning isn't valid. Not only is he wrong that it doesn't impact him, because VTI is impacted, but the whole premise is wrong. "I'm not harmed" does not mean things are fine. If I go murder your neighbor, will you come to my trial and demand I go free because you weren't harmed? Should the judge let me go because he wasn't harmed? |
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| ▲ | stackghost 3 hours ago | parent | prev [-] | | >QQQ and /NQ or /MNQ futures are the most popular instruments for getting exposure. QQQ tracks the Nasdaq 100. It's an index fund. If the index includes a new ticker, then QQQ has to buy it. Buying QQQ doesn't seem like going out of one's way. I don't understand your comment. "ETFs and chill" is a very common investment strategy. | | |
| ▲ | lokar 2 hours ago | parent | next [-] | | You could buy QQNE :) | |
| ▲ | quickthrowman 3 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-] | | There’s an order of magnitude more money indexed to the S&P 500, you have to go out out your way to buy QQQ since NASDAQ 100 and total market funds are uncommon in 401K options for employees. QQQ is more volatile and higher risk than the S&P 500, the people buying it should understand that. | |
| ▲ | tjwebbnorfolk 3 hours ago | parent | prev [-] | | And who is forced to buy QQQ? | | |
| ▲ | lokar 2 hours ago | parent | next [-] | | Many retirement accounts have limited options, leaving few passive index options. I sort of doubt many would offer qqq but not s&p, but it’s possible | |
| ▲ | stackghost 3 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-] | | I'm not sure why that's relevant. The original discussion was about who's forced to buy NDX 100 stocks like SpaceX. The answer to that is "index funds". Asked and answered. Whatever cute point you're trying to make is rendered moot by real market dynamics and index inclusion rules. | |
| ▲ | wredcoll 2 hours ago | parent | prev [-] | | Why was musk/spacex so interested in having the rules broken to include spacex stock? Do you think maybe there was a reason that involved musk benefitting?? |
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| ▲ | NetMageSCW 3 hours ago | parent | prev [-] |
| Who forces them? |
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| ▲ | malfist 3 hours ago | parent | next [-] | | Literally the index. If you track the NASDAQ as part of your index you must obey it's inclusion rules. | | |
| ▲ | tjwebbnorfolk 3 hours ago | parent | next [-] | | Contrary to (apparently) popular opinion, index funds are not people. So, who is being forced to buy that index? | | |
| ▲ | rossng 2 hours ago | parent | next [-] | | A lot of employer pensions will have limited fund options. (At least in the UK, maybe the US works differently.) Quite likely that the only sensible one for most people (~global equities) will track S&P 500 internally. So essentially employees are being forced to hold whatever the index includes. Hopefully it's less of a problem with Nasdaq, but it was a real worry. | |
| ▲ | pessimizer 2 hours ago | parent | prev [-] | | Turns out people (and institutions like municipalities and pension funds) sometimes buy index funds before SpaceX enters the NASDAQ 100, and changing their policies over a single event would be a great effort and expense, and set a bad precedent. Sounds crazy, but it's true. Nobody has any idea what point you're trying to make, and the fact that you're repeating yourself and not being clearer makes everyone suspect that you don't have any idea either. |
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| ▲ | hk__2 3 hours ago | parent | prev [-] | | Ok but there are very few indices following NASDAQ, compared to S&P 500. | | |
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| ▲ | khurs 3 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-] | | Funds often have institutional investors. Many of them Pension Funds (i.e. ordinary every day people) and when the institutional investors signed up, they didn't do so expecting Nasdaq rule change. | |
| ▲ | jovial_cavalier 3 hours ago | parent | prev [-] | | that is the whole point of an index fund - they buy whatever is in the index so you can get exposure to the total market. The scandalous thing is that an IPO'd company is going to have a lot of volatility for weeks to months after it goes public, so they typically do not allow any newly listed company to be included in the index for up to one year. This is for the benefit of retail. People have put their entire life savings into these funds because they are viewed as the optimal tradeoff between risk and return. Those people are now contractually obligated to either sell everything or expose themselves to spacex's IPO price movements. | | |
| ▲ | metadat 3 hours ago | parent [-] | | There are many different kinds of index funds, most don’t participate in Nasdaq 100. |
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