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pocketarc 4 hours ago

In the olden days, I enjoyed Opus 3 because it was easy to have it sound way more human than GPT.

Nowadays, with the focus on agentic use and coding, it seems models have all been RLHF’d to death, it’s so incredibly hard to have them write in a different voice than their default. I put together a skill to review its writing and have it edit its own output (e.g. code comments), which does make a difference, but isn’t perfect.

What, if anything, do people do for writing? That feels like a neglected side of LLMs. They’ll make 100 Bash calls referencing ancient commands without batting an eye but heaven forbid they use something other than “load-bearing” while talking. For something trained on “all the human knowledge” it’s incredible how limited their default vocabulary seems to be.

Retr0id 4 hours ago | parent | next [-]

> What, if anything, do people do for writing?

I use a keyboard, personally.

bunderbunder 4 hours ago | parent | next [-]

Amen.

At work our documentation isn’t just getting littered with annoying jargon. It isn’t just all the hallucinations, either. (Since when has documentation ever been 100% trustworthy?) It’s that it’s so poorly written and structured that it’s becoming borderline incomprehensible.

My company is currently considering making, “Why should I bother to read something you didn’t bother to write?” an official policy because even the executives are starting to burn out on all the time they have to spend wading through slop.

mywittyname 12 minutes ago | parent | next [-]

I wish my company would do this. A coworker pulled an all nighter before a vacation and just left me with a million line claude summary of their work then just fucked off. The message was two-part due to size and lacked basic stuff like, "how to run".

He's going to be annoyed that none of that work was used. But the reality is, at least 75% of claude generated text is pointless.

chrisandchris 2 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

If it wasn't worth your time writing, it isn't worth my time reading.

madcaptenor an hour ago | parent [-]

ai;dr

pegasus 4 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

This, a thousand times. As the ratio of code to human writing necessarily [1] goes up, they become not just smarter, but more precise and technical, which requires them to use more jargon. You could say they become more nerdy. Hence, text generated by these models will become more easily recognizable, at least by default, when not asking them to twist themselves into something else via prompting — which degrades intelligence. This is a good thing, in my book, given all the slop we already have to contend with.

Of course there will be models trained on much less code and technical writing, and they will create more natural sounding prose, but they will lack the deep intelligence of frontier models. Seems like a fair tradeoff.

[1] watch the first couple of minutes on this bycloud video on scaling training data mixtures: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aD93kfArOik

moron4hire 4 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

[dead]

mhitza 41 minutes ago | parent | prev | next [-]

> Nowadays, with the focus on agentic use and coding, it seems models have all been RLHF’d to death

This has also lead to unrelated associations by which some people went from seeing better coding capabilities and extrapolate to assuming better thinking overall. One only has to watch youtube videos of AI "normies" trying to use LLMs the intended way to see that the improvements on coding doesn't translate to other applications. Basically from AGI "goals" they are now hyperfocused on coding agents, until the next marketing breakthrough rears its head.

postalcoder 4 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

It's why I like Gemini 3.1 Pro. That it sounds much more human than other LLMs is testament to Google's inability to post train.

gemini-2.5-pro-experimental was the GOAT, though. It was an emotional wreck, down in the dumps and feeling terrible for itself after failing to patch a file several times. Very amusing to read, all the while watching it make a mess of my codebase.

boofus 4 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

Good. I don't want LLMs sounding human. I want the ability to shame and discredit anyone passing the job of prose to a machine. There's an art to writing, and hopefully LLMs never truly get it right.

constantius 3 hours ago | parent [-]

Agreed. The only goal of these skills/tricks/requests for humanising LLM writing is to be able to pass it off as your own, because they know it's shameful and want to avoid the opprobrium.

Some will say it's just for their own quality of life when they're reading LLM output, or "just for docs", but this is an extremely marginal use case.

sheepscreek 4 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

Agreed. I think we’re entering an era where some level of specialization for general LLMs is a good thing. Particularly between tuning for agentic use cases (where you want agency with a ton of guardrails and control) and writing which is more creative - you want the model to take the occasional risk and not sound like a monotonic robot. Having trained models first-hand, I can see the distinct use-cases clearly that are odds with one another.

Wowfunhappy 4 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

For what it's worth, Anthropic seems to be keeping Opus 3 available on claude.ai, perhaps for this reason, so you're free to use it if you want to.

p-e-w 4 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

> Nowadays, with the focus on agentic use and coding, it seems models have all been RLHF’d to death

I don’t get it. If nobody likes this writing style, how can it be the result of human feedback? Something else is going on.

anon373839 3 hours ago | parent | next [-]

Because LLMs are pattern-extenders that have nothing to say. The training overfitted to the grace notes in good writing. And since LLMs can’t wield language with purpose or experience the feeling of the words, they use these devices arbitrarily.

I think this is the same flaw as coding agents seeing in every problem the call for a “smoke test” or the use of some unnecessary design pattern. The truest part of AI is the A.

cindyllm 2 hours ago | parent [-]

[dead]

pathsjs 4 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

It's not that the writing style is bad; in fact LLMs write actually pretty well. It's just too much overfitted. And even a style that, in itself, is pleasurable to read, becomes annoying when the same figures of speech are used over and over again.

Wowfunhappy 4 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

Because humans do like it, in reasonable quantities. The AI overlearns this and does it too much.

yusefnapora 2 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

It's not that nobody likes it, in fact the problem is that people like each instance of it well enough in isolation. Millions of people think it's "good enough," so it gets amplified and repeated until every PR description starts to sound like a toothpaste jingle.

Bawoosette 4 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

For "agentic use and coding," they are trained to take useful actions, not produce desirable natural language writing.

itopaloglu83 4 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

Maybe it’s the dead internet.

All the bots and other LLMs providing feedback, so in reality it’s reflecting the reality in a sense.

jappgar 4 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

every one-hit wonder asks the same question.

we liked it until we didn't.

michelb 4 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

i hate it, but plenty of people DO like it and plenty of people talk and write like that. It’s just corpspeak, being used a lot in the valley and beyond. And all upcoming hustlers running startups now feel the need to speak like that, feeding this machine.