| ▲ | moffkalast a day ago |
| In ten years we'll look at human written code like the unreliable garbage it is, and never rely on anything that wasn't at least seriously looked over by an LLM. It won't be even close. |
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| ▲ | KronisLV a day ago | parent | next [-] |
| > never rely on anything that wasn't at least seriously looked over by an LLM I can imagine LLMs becoming a mainstay, but what you are describing isn't wholly different from sufficiently advanced static code analysis - where you'd want more determinism than most LLMs normally provide. The problem is that such a thing might take a decade and billions of dollars of investments to create per-language (e.g. actually useful code analysis for Java, for Spring Boot, for processing and validating form data, and DB schemas and document processing and rendering reports etc., literal domain checks for anything and everything that is common across various enterprises) so nobody wants to do that, so it's easier to throw LLMs at it and call it good enough. |
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| ▲ | moffkalast a day ago | parent [-] | | I remember back in the pre-2023 days where SonarQube was a big deal for Java static analysis, and I let it rip across an entire 120k line project at one point upon which it found something like seven issues, out of which only one or two were actual bugs. It was almost entirely useless. I think even Qwen would've done leagues better today. Most bugs are far too nuanced to be caught by static analysis imo, you do need to actually understand what's going on in the program, the intent, the environment, etc. instead of blindly verifying if everything technically checks out, compilers already do a perfect job at that. | | |
| ▲ | KronisLV a day ago | parent [-] | | > everything technically checks out So who's responsible for all of the Spring Dependency Injection bullshit with circular dependencies and AOP issues, stuff like @Transactional only working when called from a different bean, as well as the other hundreds of issues I've seen throughout the years? One can't just ignore that, because in many places that is most of the job market (alongside maybe .NET or PHP). There's got to be some traditional way to spot every single one of the states that can be represented in code by the frameworks available in a given language, surely the correct answer is not "Yeah, an LLM said it looks okay because it's close enough to some training data that we have." It might be the practical answer, but only because all of our tech is built wrong. Then again, writing provably correct code might be impossible in Java, at least with the currently available tools, because the ecosystem is such that the compiler can't do anything about all of the dynamic stuff that evil developers make you deal with at runtime. |
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| ▲ | hypfer a day ago | parent | prev | next [-] |
| Yes, the same way 10 years from now-10years, we'd all be looking back at how insane it was for people to drive cars. Man do I enjoy my totally real full self driving. |
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| ▲ | BurritoKing a day ago | parent | next [-] | | I find this attitude really weird. I just checked and I have 8,793 miles driven on my car and of that I'd say ~8750 of them were done by fsd (self driving). These days most of my interventions are to pick a different parking spot, and I can't remember the last time I had a serious disengagement, it's always just me wanting to drive a different route, park in a different location, or sometimes to handle things like car washes and the like. For me, for all intents and purposes, self driving is here today. | |
| ▲ | karahime a day ago | parent | prev [-] | | You're being sarcastic, but I do enjoy it. I just took a Waymo recently and it was thrilling, it felt great to feel the wind and the sun, listen to music, and get where I was going without having to drive there. I still like driving, obviously, but being able to decide one or the other is wonderful. |
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| ▲ | lioeters a day ago | parent | prev | next [-] |
| In ten years we'll be drowning in subtle bugs introduced by the unreliable garbage that is machine-generated code, and the industry will hopefully have learned to never rely on anything that wasn't at least seriously looked over by an actual thinking human being that understands it. We'll look back on our youthful idealism and cultish faith in this new technology with embarrassment. |
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| ▲ | gspr 15 hours ago | parent [-] | | I'm a bit more pessimistic. > In ten years we'll be drowning in subtle bugs introduced by the unreliable garbage that is machine-generated code Yes. But replace > and the industry will hopefully have learned to never rely on anything that wasn't at least seriously looked over by an actual thinking human being that understands it. with: "and the industry will throw even more LLMs at the problem, producing an even deeper soup of garbage that in some cases perform a tiny bit better, and when things do break it's always the fault of someone else. So for example a bank denies you a mortgage or an insurance company fails to process your claim, and you are almost certain that it's due to some slopcode somewhere, but you have to suck it up because the world has become accustomed that this is just how things are done." It's a way of breaking computers that I'd never thought I'd see. We're wilfully taking the one cool thing about computers – them exactly interpreting instructions carefully crafted by humans to do exactly the right thing – with bucketloads of vibes that hopefully mostly do the right thing most of the time ("the tests pass"). What the hell are we doing. |
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| ▲ | gspr a day ago | parent | prev | next [-] |
| Alternate take: in ten years we'll be pulling our hair out cursing at the world over how we could possibly accept "10k lines added, 8k lines removed" as the normal everyday churn of software development. We'll curse the morons who gave up understanding our own code. |
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| ▲ | fatata123 19 hours ago | parent | prev [-] |
| In ten years, crypto will be the world’s primary currency. Oh look, stupid hot takes aren’t that hard to have after all. |