Remix.run Logo
sgustard 4 hours ago

"best not to blame the students"

There are dozens for every one who didn't get the opportunity to attend an Ivy. The penalty for cheating should be automatic expulsion. I'll note as a hiring manager the college degree won't be worth shit unless the school can show their students have any integrity.

onion2k an hour ago | parent | next [-]

The penalty for cheating should be automatic expulsion.

Universities need to stay ahead of how people actually work. Framing the use of AI as 'cheating' gives a university a reputation that it isn't keeping up with industry, which has a wildly negative impact on admissions. You can't expel people for 'working like they do in the real world'.

JumpCrisscross 3 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

Totally agree. The moral decay in higher education has a lot to do with it deciding to trade its integrity around cheating by students and professors in exchange for tuition cheques and grant money.

ShinyLeftPad 3 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

Yes. Best not blame the technology that was specifically built to pass up automatically generated text for human work, or companies that profit from students using it, or government that won't introduce measures that would at least make it possible to comprehensively ban it on campuses.

nerdsniper 2 hours ago | parent [-]

What sort of measures would those be? The government also banned alcohol on campus (except Louisiana) but as a 20 year old I was too stubborn to care.

MengerSponge 3 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

There are schools with severe penalties for cheating (Army/Navy, Haverford, Davidson), but most aren't set up for that. Professors didn't self-select to be prosecutors, and we didn't spend decades becoming world experts to then become cops.

Love the sinner, hate the sin. If you let yourself start blaming students, you open a pretty corrosive path of moral judgement. Students are clever, and they're making choices informed by what they see in the world. Don't blame them for being unwilling to fail a class that cost a down payment on a house. Don't blame them for seeing powerful people get away with cheating and trying to do the same.

Kallus is right: qualitative assessment is an adversarial problem. Build the assessment correctly, and all of those previous points become moot. By clearly establishing and enforcing the rules you make it more fair to boot.

MattGaiser 3 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

I doubt it. The concept of cheating is largely unique to academia and a few uptight professions like law. Everywhere else it is just collaboration or learning or simply something nobody cares about.

I would say that tech largely rewards the behaviours people in academia call cheating.

jonahx 2 hours ago | parent [-]

> The concept of cheating is largely unique to academia and a few uptight professions

What? The concept of cheating exists in marriages, sports, relationships, business agreements, accounting, and nearly every facet of human life.