I will die on the hill that Java was a good language, and had the potential to leapfrog us from where we are by at least a decade.

But it got hobbled by the awful, awful enterprise style culture, cultural misunderstanding of OOP (especially inheritance), and corporation shenanigans (fucking oracle).

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boofus a day ago | parent | next [-]

Java may be good, but it's boring. No joy comes from programming in Java.

I need to enjoy my work to be engaged and productive.

	▲	FelipeCortez a day ago \| parent \| next [-]
		You can use Clojure to get all the goodness from Java and still have fun
	▲	bigstrat2003 a day ago \| parent \| prev [-]
		That is a matter of taste. I enjoy programming in Java just fine.

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LtWorf a day ago | parent | prev [-]

I have nothing against java. But for some reason in my experience all the developers using it are low quality, and gave it the reputation it has.

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steve_adams_86 a day ago | parent [-]

I think this is a selection bias speaking rather than a reasonable reflection of what goes on in the Java world. Some insanely sophisticated and high quality technologies are written with Java.

The problem is like with JS or PHP, it is ubiquitous in many settings. There are a lot of people who can use it because it was the default language taught in CS programs, many corporate settings for decades, or similar. It’s the runtime for android devices. It’s everywhere. Of course you’ll encounter a lot of low quality developers.

Your comment mostly indicates that you haven’t been fortunate enough to encounter the high quality Java devs, not that they don’t exist. They exist and they build world class software that backs massive systems like elastic search, Kafka, spark, or Cassandra.

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LtWorf a day ago | parent [-]

When I started to use elastic search I found out that with some incorrect queries you could "poison" the process entirely and it would respond incorrectly to every single query from that moment on, until you killed it and restarted it.

They responded to my issue several years later. I had changed jobs and I couldn't care less any longer.

If that's your example of quality… well…

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steve_adams_86 21 hours ago | parent [-]

If a single outlying case in a broadly used piece of software is your example of an entire language's developer base, well...

	▲	LtWorf 21 hours ago \| parent [-]
		A critical bug in your example of excellent software written in java. I've of course seen many horrors in other java projects.