| ▲ | OtherShrezzing 5 hours ago |
| > robot maid that could clean, wash and fold the laundry, do the dishes, etc. would be huge. I think a lot of people would pay new-car money for something like that. Once you take maintenance of a machine with price-parity to a new car into consideration, it’s surely cost competitive to just hire a human to do all those things. The price needs to fall drastically below new-car territory before it’s competitive with manual human labour. |
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| ▲ | Reason077 5 hours ago | parent | next [-] |
| > ”it’s surely cost competitive to just hire a human to do all those things.” The cost of labour varies hugely in different parts of the world. The cost of hiring someone in Switzerland is on the order of 100X more expensive compared to Bangladesh, for example. With many countries currently in an anti-immigration political mindset and with birth rates declining globally, labour costs are likely to continue to increase in the future. But once a technology like general-purpose humanoid robotics exists, it’s costs are only likely to decrease over time. |
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| ▲ | addaon 4 hours ago | parent | next [-] | | > it’s costs are only likely to decrease over time What is this based on? We're well past a 50-ish year deflationary period in the cost of major appliances (refrigerators, washing machines, etc). We're pretty clearly at or near the end of the deflationary era for computers and computation. Automotive... speaks for itself. We're still there for televisions, surprisingly; but it looks like these technologies tend to have a handful of decades of rapid cost decrease, followed by a never-ending cost increase over time as the manufacturers consolidate and claim an ever-increasing margin. | | |
| ▲ | seanmcdirmid 4 hours ago | parent | next [-] | | The computer of 10 years ago is still a lot cheaper than a modern model. Deflation stops basically only if hardware advancement stops. EVs are a great example: they keep getting cheaper for what they provide, even if the price stays the same. 200 miles of range 5 years ago is now 400+ miles of range today. Compared to ICEs, where advancement has stalled for the last 20 years, which seem like a worse deal every year. | | |
| ▲ | jen20 2 hours ago | parent [-] | | > Compared to ICEs, where advancement has stalled for the last 20 years, It hasn't really stalled: VVT, VCR, Cylinder deactivation that works properly, and start-stop becoming commonplace are all meaningful improvements (though smaller than the ones seen in EVs over the same time frame, which makes sense given the relative maturity). | | |
| ▲ | seanmcdirmid 2 hours ago | parent [-] | | ICE advancements haven’t materially affected car performance like EV advancements have. Start-stop is considered an annoyance to most car owners, for example, not a feature. It is mostly because ICE tech is mature and has no real place to go for improvements beyond incremental refinement. EVs can ride the wave of battery tech advancements for another decade or two. |
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| ▲ | kelipso 3 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-] | | Those are all tech that almost everyone owns. Makes sense that mass production would reduce costs and then the cost reductions would go towards zero. For new technology that hasn't been mass produced, it's a completely different story. | | |
| ▲ | addaon 3 hours ago | parent [-] | | But that's my point. If you're basing your society shape around adopting a technology based on it continually decreasing in price, but you only get a few decades of that behavior before saturation and then you're at the mercy of the consolidated winners... generally adoptions like this aren't reversible at the societal level. You're locking in a long-term structural change based on a short-term pricing trend. |
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| ▲ | szundi 4 hours ago | parent | prev [-] | | [dead] |
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| ▲ | fhars 4 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-] | | Just like RAM and disk prices have been continually decreasing for as long as people remember. | |
| ▲ | 4 hours ago | parent | prev [-] | | [deleted] |
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| ▲ | nonethewiser 3 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-] |
| A new car is what, $25-50K? Thats a one time cost. How much do you think youd need to pay a maid every year to do your cooking, cleaning, laundry, dirty dishes etc? Coming once a day for 2 hours would be very expensive and still wouldnt be comparable to a robot that you own and is constantly deployed. And at that point you’re probably comparing owning a robot to renting one. |
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| ▲ | to11mtm 4 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-] |
| > it’s surely cost competitive to just hire a human to do all those things. Depends on the service life/performance/etc. As a simple benchmark, I will propose 'Mowing the lawn with a push mower'. Let's wave hands and assume there is a setup on a truck where the mower can be parked and then lifted in. If you're paying the people doing that lawn-mowing federal minimum wage, at 40 hours a week it's 15K/year. After 3 years that's 45K, or a little under the current US median price of a new car. IOW, if the robot costs 45-50K, but can make it through 4 years without expensive maintenance you are still 'saving costs'. There's hand-waving on both sides of my equation; At least where I live even pushing a lawnmower gets you a bit more than minimum wage (although it is more seasonal,) and also I have no clue if when we say 'new car territory' we are talking median or an 80K EV. |
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| ▲ | greggsy 4 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-] |
| Price aside, the more important factor is that we don’t have the repair infrastructure to make something like this worthwhile yet.
For something as critical as a car, we have workshops, spare parts supply chains, and the skilled technicians to do the repairs.
Conventional robots require a similar skill set, but you still won’t be able to rely on a local repair for something people would expect to be dependable, like aged care or home assistance. |
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| ▲ | fragmede 5 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-] |
| Humans are messy to deal with. Say you're rich enough to afford a personal chef. Unless you're an inhuman monster, their problems become your problems as well. So if your chef is out because their mother is sick and needs someone to take care of her, you pay for a nurse for your chef's mom, so that you have your chef. A robot servant is still gonna need maintenance, sure, but it's a bit easier to be callous to a robot than a person. |
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| ▲ | ian-g 5 hours ago | parent | next [-] | | I think that’s a feature. Not a bug. | |
| ▲ | queueueue 4 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-] | | But for now, humanoids are still relatively incompetent. So if you're rich enough and you want things done like cleaning and cooking, it's more convenient to hire a human and give them specific instructions instead of buying a robot that can currently do only half the things they want to get done. Or they just want a nice gadget. | |
| ▲ | Benlovescnn 4 hours ago | parent | prev [-] | | >but it's a bit easier to be callous to a robot than a person. George Jetson always dreamed of beating a robot chef/maid. |
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| ▲ | calvinmorrison 5 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-] |
| maintenance cost of machines is largely driven by human labor cost |
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| ▲ | Forgeties79 5 hours ago | parent | prev [-] |
| If you're paying cash/under the table, then maybe. But even then a twice a week household cleaning hire is going to cost upwards of $1500/mo unless you're being particularly exploitative. If you're not under the table, you're paying payroll taxes, probably paying for a payroll service, etc. so you're talking $2000+. At best you can maybe stay under $20k a year. When you really look at the economics of it, a robot that never gets sick/doesn't require payroll/etc. makes a lot more sense. |
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| ▲ | midnightclubbed 5 hours ago | parent | next [-] | | This comment seems insane to me. Like at $50 an hour thats 30 hours a month, or 8 hoursish a week. How dirty or huge is the house? And $50 an hour is way over what most hourly degree edgucated workers earn so definitely not exploitation. | | |
| ▲ | what 2 hours ago | parent [-] | | I pay $40/h for 4 hours once a month. If the wife had her way, it would be weekly. | | |
| ▲ | devilbunny an hour ago | parent [-] | | But presumably would not be for four hours a week, since they would do more maintenance-like cleaning. Once a month, yeah, it’s going to take that long. |
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| ▲ | dh2022 5 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-] | | Who spends new-car money to clean their homes? Maybe ultra high net worth individuals? I know people with 8 figures net worth who spend a fraction of that money for cleaning their homes. | |
| ▲ | RussianCow 5 hours ago | parent | prev [-] | | > But even then a twice a week household cleaning hire is going to cost upwards of $1500/mo unless you're being particularly exploitative. Sorry, what? Unless you're doing a deep clean of your house twice a week or you live in a particularly HCOL area, those numbers don't add up. You shouldn't be spending more than $1k/month on household chores, and even that seems high. Source: A client of ours runs a "personal help" service (mostly focused on household tasks like laundry, tidying, organizing, etc as opposed to deep cleaning) so I have a lot of data on this. And they're a relatively premium service compared to some of the cheap labor you can actually buy. But they also don't operate in SF or NYC, so maybe prices are drastically different there. | | |
| ▲ | seanmcdirmid 4 hours ago | parent | next [-] | | $1k/month in an HCOL like here in Seattle doesn't give you much: > In Seattle, hiring a house cleaner typically costs $150 to $500+ per visit, with most recurring standard cleanings for an average-sized home landing between $180 and $300. If you pay by the hour, rates generally range from $45 to $65 per hour for self-employed independent cleaners and $75 to $125 per hour for professional cleaning companies. | |
| ▲ | wildzzz 3 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-] | | Yeah I only see robomaids as an affordable option for someone that needs help with absolutely everything. These things are built out of commodity parts. Maybe you can make a robomaid a little cheaper if you build a lot of them to offset the upfront costs but not by much. Anytime the robomaid isn't working, it's just decreases the value of having one versus how much you paid for it. So the point would be to put it to work as much as possible such as for an elderly person that's unable to do anything for themselves. | |
| ▲ | midnightclubbed 5 hours ago | parent | prev [-] | | Even in high cost of living coastal Southern California these numbers are insane unless you have a $10mil house with 10,000sqft | | |
| ▲ | what 2 hours ago | parent [-] | | Not really? I pay $40/h, it takes them 4 hours to clean a 4 bed/2 bath. I do it once a month, but they’re talking twice a week. |
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