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spoaceman7777 3 hours ago

It's important to factor in just how many US adults are basically illiterate nowadays.

As of 2023, 27% of American working-age adults were at a PIAAC Literacy Level of 1 or below, out of a total of 5 levels. This has gotten drastically worse in the past 10 years as, in 2013, Level 1 and below was only 17%.

Full scores for 2023 are: % Level 1 or below: 27% Level 2: 29% Level 3: 31% Level 4/5: 13%

For reference, Level 1 means someone can't really handle a full page of text, and can sort of handle simple 1-page web pages. Level 2 is the point where someone can start to handle a few pages of straightforward text, but still nothing particularly complicated.

(Both of those descriptions undersell just how bad it really is, but I'll leave it at that, for the sake of brevity.)

People that aren't using AI at all often aren't using it because they effectively can't. On a fundamental level.

Source: https://nces.ed.gov/surveys/piaac/2023/national_results.asp

ticulatedspline 2 hours ago | parent | next [-]

those levels weren't what I was expecting.

https://nces.ed.gov/surveys/piaac/measure.asp?section=1&sub_...

I'm curious as to how I would score, I would definitely count myself as "literate" but I wonder how well I'd do on the level 4/5 tasks and if they cross over into more general memory, intelligence, and study habit metrics that even a normally "literate" person would not do well at.

Though given those descriptions I can't help thinking those would be great tests for AI. I'd love to see the proficiency scores for various models.

EDIT: Ok I just needed to scroll further, they have sample items in the last section up to level 4 and even at level 4 the question seemed trivial.

The most wordy one is the Q Drum article (which by the way Q drum is a real thing, kinda neat idea) and there's literally only two basic criticisms (flat land and expense) and if you had any idea what the life straw is you can probably construe what the similar criticism in the email is going to be without even looking.

Based on the scores and the proficiency description I assumed they were actually targeting some sort of normal distribution and levels 4/5 would be genuinely difficult explaining the scores. I'm now much more sad that the scores are so low.

At least I got a laugh at how they refer to each test item as "the stimulus" which has such a sterile/clinical flavor to it.

JohnnyMarcone an hour ago | parent | prev | next [-]

"Response rates for this data collection were relatively low, both for the United States and for several other participating countries. There is evidence that procedures implemented to reduce bias associated with nonresponse have done so, and that the data are representative of the population. However, readers should be aware of the potential for bias and use caution when interpreting PIAAC results."

These stats don't pass the smell test. About a third of people in the US have a bachelor's degree, but only 13% can pass level 4/5 literacy challenge? If you dig into the sample questions, they are not hard. A level 4 task has the person read a short article and pull out the criticisms of some products.

I know not everyone with a bachelor's degree is 'smart' but it's hard to believe 2/3rds couldn't pass level 4/5.

Also 13% have a master's degree, does that mean those 13% are the only people passing level 4/5?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Educational_attainment_in_the_...

spoaceman7777 7 minutes ago | parent [-]

That's just a standard disclaimer.

This is just how it is out there. Ask teachers what students are like these days. Think about designing for users. Or cross-reference with other info on this topic.

And, in regard to colleges... you have to keep in mind just how many colleges there are, how much the quality differs, the relative workloads of different degrees. There are a lot of people graduating with a GPA quite close to 2.0 at that full range too.

Also, think of how many college graduates never finish a book again after graduating college. Those numbers judge 18 to 65. And the age stats show that the older cohorts drag the scores down significantly.

The only upside to all of this is that it at least makes the chaos out there in the world make a bit more sense.

layer8 3 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

I don’t think that’s it. AI mobile apps support voice conversations. And low literacy is rather a motivation for using AI to generate and summarize text.

spoaceman7777 3 hours ago | parent [-]

Just getting to the point of using a voice mode is a challenge at that level. Like, we're talking about "has trouble formulating a question to ask in the first place".

There's a whole level of ignorance out there that is honestly dumbfounding to even comprehend. The numbers for numeracy and problem solving are even more horrifying.

(It's for this reason that the most popular apps in the US are algorithmically generated feeds of photos, and often-non-verbal videos shorter than a TV advertisement.)

foxglacier 2 hours ago | parent [-]

I thought not needing words was because people often watch them on their phone in public without sound. Who are these people that can't enjoy listening to spoken words because of illiteracy or ignorance?

simonw 2 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

I lurk on the teachers subreddit and get shown videos by teachers on TikTok and the impression I get from that algorithmic bubble is that the kids can't read any more - reading comprehension in particular is terrible. Lots of anecdotes of kids who can't read a few paragraphs and then answer questions about what was in them.

serial_dev 2 hours ago | parent [-]

That subreddit is likely an echo chamber.

You would not judge what people think about politics by only reading comments on a Hasan Piker video (or only on a Nick Fuentes video).

simonw 41 minutes ago | parent | next [-]

That's why I said "the impression I get from that algorithmic bubble"

krainboltgreene an hour ago | parent | prev [-]

Hasan Piker's political project polls extremely high (universal healthcare, abortion access, and more), so actually you could understand American voter politics by reading Hasan's comments amusingly enough.