| ▲ | vmg12 an hour ago |
| I think its a mistake to fight datacenters and AI. Taking a step back, if the US unilaterally stops producing AI will other countries stop? The answer is clearly no. Datacenters and ai can be built and trained anywhere. If you want control over AI you should want it to be built in your own country where you have political representation. All preventing datacenter buildout will do is ensure that the price remains high and only really rich organizations can access it. |
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| ▲ | UtopiaPunk an hour ago | parent | next [-] |
| You're starting with an assumption that AI is, on the whole, a net positive for society. A lot of people would disagree. |
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| ▲ | riversflow 42 minutes ago | parent | next [-] | | Nuclear bombs and ICBMs aren’t a net positive for society either, but not pursuing them is bad geopolitical strategy. | |
| ▲ | gyanchawdhary an hour ago | parent | prev | next [-] | | It’s great for society. It may not be working for you, but don’t project that on the rest of the world. | | |
| ▲ | npinsker 35 minutes ago | parent [-] | | That’s so far from obvious. The most concerning possibilities for me — like kids not learning how to struggle or problem solve on their own — won’t be resolved for many years. |
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| ▲ | aspenmartin an hour ago | parent | prev [-] | | Of course and a lot of people disagree that vaccines work, why does this negate any hard evidence? | | |
| ▲ | jameslars an hour ago | parent | next [-] | | Is the hard evidence of AI being a net improvement for society in the room with us now? | | |
| ▲ | rickydroll 42 minutes ago | parent | next [-] | | If I'm in the room, yes. For me, AI is one, is the best handicap accessibility tool I've ever had. At a minimum, speech recognition is a higher quality, and second, it lets me write code again. I'm working on the third benefit, which is it helps me organize, helps my ADHD mind organize large chunks of random information. If you look around, you'll find the AI has made some significant improvements to medicine and engineering. These improvements get drowned out by the AI Cheerleaders, but they're there. | | |
| ▲ | jameslars 5 minutes ago | parent | next [-] | | I like this argument/reasoning more than any I've encountered so far. Thank you! Enabling the disabled is definitely a positive and this is a strong argument for the "pro AI" column. | |
| ▲ | bluefirebrand 9 minutes ago | parent | prev [-] | | > helps my ADHD mind organize large chunks of random information. I keep seeing this and I'm pretty envious! You must have a different form of ADHD than I do. For me, trying to use AI to build anything is terrible for my attention, it turns everything into a miserable slog because it's so hands off. I miss getting into flow. |
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| ▲ | aspenmartin 37 minutes ago | parent | prev [-] | | Depends, is the net improvement of the internet, electricity, agriculture, steam engine also in the room? | | |
| ▲ | gensym 19 minutes ago | parent | next [-] | | I don't understand that this argument. Why does the net improvement of the technologies listed imply that AI will also have a net improvement? Are you just arguing that there's no such thing as technology that is harmful on net? | |
| ▲ | nancyminusone 26 minutes ago | parent | prev [-] | | Asbestos is the miracle material it is advertised as. It really is great insulation, and really is absolutely fireproof. Thousands of industrial uses are readily apparent. Despite this, because of its other effects, the cost to clean up and stop using asbestos is greater than the sum total of any benefit from all mined asbestos worldwide. Even a miracle technology can still be a net disaster. |
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| ▲ | kami23 an hour ago | parent | prev | next [-] | | I am unsure what you mean by hard evidence in the context of AI then, what is the evidence we are negating in your view? | |
| ▲ | andagar1243 41 minutes ago | parent | prev | next [-] | | What is the hard evidence that you speak of? | |
| ▲ | junek an hour ago | parent | prev | next [-] | | Are you really comparing LLMs to vaccines? Jesus | |
| ▲ | goatlover an hour ago | parent | prev | next [-] | | We could have had this same argument about social media 15 years ago before hard evidence showed it's not quite the net benefit to society it was touted as. | |
| ▲ | vitally3643 an hour ago | parent | prev [-] | | You presume there is hard evidence that AI is good for society. In reality, the inverse is true. Now you understand why anti-vaxxers ignore evidence. Because it doesn't fit with your worldview and you're too narrow-minded and selfish to consider that your viewpoint might actually be wrong and bad for others. |
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| ▲ | swatcoder 39 minutes ago | parent | prev | next [-] |
| Even if you do want datacenters built in your country, you probably don't want them built at the maximally explotative locations that their developers pursue. They don't provide appreciable community value and they effectively mine limited local resources (power, grid capacity, land, water) and sell it as compute, immediately diverting the profit back out of the local economy and into very distant business accounts instead. Builders choose their targets specifically by how well they can strong-arm weak/vulnerable communities into letting them build these mines through political influence and misrepresentation. It's bad. What you probably want is to leverage their global market value to establish new power and grid capacity in undeveloped areas, perhaps to someday become a seed for
new communities that grow around the infrastructure development work. But that's much more expensive than bullying and seducing a weak city council so it won't happen with regional/state/federal regulatory protections or incentives that push them away from the exploitative opportunities and towards the constructive ones. |
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| ▲ | nancyminusone 37 minutes ago | parent | prev | next [-] |
| Why should I think that I "own" or control a datacenter built in my town compared to one built in another country? It's pretty unlikely anything I do will have any effect on what goes on inside one even if I work there. The greatest control I have is probably to have it not get built, though even that is minimal as it has failed to stop the one that is indeed being built in my town. |
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| ▲ | gensym an hour ago | parent | prev | next [-] |
| For people worried about their livelihoods, there's value in slowing AI adoption to give our economy time to transition rather than just throwing a lot of people out of work all at the same time. |
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| ▲ | 3sk_ask8 an hour ago | parent | prev | next [-] |
| Yes, it is vital to create more slop and Anime figures. We need to win that race at all costs. So urgent that Andreesen has a Super PAC to push the dangerous China narrative. |
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| ▲ | Henchman21 37 minutes ago | parent | prev | next [-] |
| Counterpoint: Only C-suite members and billionaires have political representation in the US. |
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| ▲ | catigula an hour ago | parent | prev | next [-] |
| There's no such thing as 'control over AI'; that goes double for someone who is a complete nobody plebian with a little baby stock portfolio. You know, basically everyone except for a select few. |
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| ▲ | goatlover an hour ago | parent [-] | | The industry can be regulated and taxed like anything else. | | |
| ▲ | UtopiaPunk an hour ago | parent [-] | | Yeah, and it should be. But the USA, at least in this current moment, builds regulations catering to corporations and the rich over people's general needs. So the regulations that are on the table at the national level are ineffective. It's easier for normal people to influence local regulations, but local regulations just push the problem somewhere else. However disdain for AI is so widespread that this is actually kind of effective. | | |
| ▲ | riversflow 38 minutes ago | parent [-] | | disdain for dumping industrial sludge into rivers is quite high too. if you don’t demand regulated domestic production it will just get moved to the least regulated place with the best underlying economics, I imagine you know this though… |
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| ▲ | conartist6 an hour ago | parent | prev [-] |
| You could say the same of human intelligence and competence and social trust. I think it's a mistake to stop producing those things. |
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| ▲ | Abh1Works an hour ago | parent | next [-] | | Fair point, but you dont produce intelligence, competence and social trust. Essentially a society earns it. Is the reason that competence and social trust are declining because of AI? Maybe, but not only that. | |
| ▲ | bpodgursky an hour ago | parent | prev [-] | | Uh yes you could but what's your point. If we make ourselves dumber, it doesn't make China dumber, human intelligence will just leave us behind. |
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