A very US-centric perspective. Whereas the folks in Europe do it in 3-4 years, come to the US and do a 2-3 year postdoc (with higher pay than a PhD student), and are ahead of their American peers.

Also, depending on where you do it in Europe, the pay as a PhD student is higher. At the extreme end, I knew students getting paid $60K/year in one country, while I was getting $24K/year in the US.

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EvgeniyZh an hour ago | parent [-]

With 2 years master's before for the same total?

	▲	BeetleB 27 minutes ago \| parent \| next [-]
		Varies from place to place. In some countries, the PhD program is fixed at 3 years. You either graduate by then, or you're out (in reality, they give some option for you to pay to continue, but almost no one can afford it). I suspect in those places, people have done a 2 year MS.
	▲	a_f 29 minutes ago \| parent \| prev \| next [-]
		In the UK I started a (3 year) PhD program without a Masters. It was not untypical.
	▲	lowbloodsugar 20 minutes ago \| parent \| prev [-]
		A US thing again? My friends all did 3 year bachelors, 3 year PhD. Some dragged out the PhD to 4. Those who do a masters do it in one year, and typically don't do a PhD. Some undergrad courses are 4 year and you get a masters at the end. And my UK bachelors was recognized as equivalent to a US masters degree for visa purposes.