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nerdjon 4 hours ago

Reading this, I can't help but feel like there is a weird correlation here going on.

It seems less specifically about the school and more about the support system and the safe place that this program gave to the girls.

It sounds like this was a program specifically built to target the reasons they were not staying in school in the first place. Which obviously is a good thing but just simply stating "stayed in school" feels like an oversimplification of what was done here.

That is an important distinction since the question to me remains if the numbers would continue without the program specifically in place.

Am I misunderstanding something here?

svnt 2 hours ago | parent | next [-]

This is not a one-off study. There is a long record of similar studies showing that the number of years of education a girl receives delays marriage, and while longer schooling delays marriage longer, it is not just because girls are busy. Schools inherently provide female social support, and education provides increased self-reliance.

This is pretty easy to reason through: if a girl knows nothing about the world, a safe place for her to be is with someone who knows more. If a girl knows how to function in the world on par with a boy/man, or at least has visibility into a future where she can, there is no longer that fear/dependence cycle locked in.

eg How Much Education Is Needed to Delay Women's Age at Marriage and First Pregnancy? https://www.frontiersin.org/journals/public-health/articles/...

The power of education to end child marriage - UNICEF DATA https://data.unicef.org/resources/child-marriage-and-educati...

flossly 2 hours ago | parent [-]

Indeed, we know this, "educate girls to fix society", already for many years. The other "societal fix we know for year to work" is reducing economic inequality.

https://www.ted.com/talks/richard_wilkinson_how_economic_ine...

wat10000 2 hours ago | parent [-]

I suspect there would be broad agreement across the political spectrum that more education means later marriage and later first pregnancy. The disagreement would mostly be over whether that's a good thing or a bad thing.

svnt an hour ago | parent | next [-]

Complication from pregnancy is the leading cause of death in 15-19 year old girls, and second in 10-14, only because many of them are not yet able to conceive. We have excellent data on this.

Later marriage/first pregnancy is clearly a good thing.

https://www.who.int/health-topics/adolescent-health/pregnanc...

mothballed 10 minutes ago | parent | next [-]

When I looked up causes of death in Nigeria, malaria blew away anything maternal related[]. Not that I would want to die of either.

Another big one was HIV/AIDS. I guess it depends on cultural factors whether early marriage might reduce the number of partners that could introduce HIV/aids. If non-married people are less monogamous it's conceivable the increased risk of HIV/AIDS could overpower the risks of whatever additional childbirth is associated with marriage.

[] https://ourworldindata.org/profile/health/nigeria

wat10000 an hour ago | parent | prev [-]

I completely agree, but there's a decent chunk of people out there who don't.

flossly an hour ago | parent | prev [-]

Smaller families, better education level of the next gen, ...

But yeah, if you are afraid of a war you want your group to be big, uneducated, easy to manipulate and expendable.

kelipso 3 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

I think so. These girls still live with their family, it’s not like they’re in some cordoned off area where marriage if forbidden. It’s just a few hours of school every weekday.

Basically there is social pressure to marry early if you’re not occupied in some way or have less prospects for employment after education.

nerdjon 3 hours ago | parent | next [-]

I get that its not like they were sent to a boarding school or something.

But it does mention accelerated catch up programs just for them, assisting financially, and vocational training.

Which is clearly more than just "stayed in school". Meaning it is something that can't just be replicated by encouraging being in school but actively needing a program like this. Which is not a bad thing obviously, but it is important that the right lesson is taken out of this.

2 hours ago | parent | next [-]
[deleted]
colechristensen 2 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

I think you may be reaching a bit for the "it's not this it's that" when it's obvious that a "get kids to stay in school" program is never "do exactly nothing besides make a kid be inside the school building reliably".

Every problem solved involves fixing dependencies.

bombcar an hour ago | parent | next [-]

But if the issue fixed as "make it possible for girls to stay home until older" and paying the families would have had the same result as schooling, it's important to know that.

Education can be a good and still not be the fundamental cause (just like going to school where they provide breakfast and lunch may be good, but the reason you grow stronger isn't the classes, it's the food).

Barbing an hour ago | parent | prev | next [-]

Non-obvious for this guy me!

smallmancontrov an hour ago | parent | prev [-]

I'm ok with hearing "it's not this it's that" if there's an overcooked "it's not that it's this" narrative nearby, and there is: education was (and is!) aggressively pushed as a cure-all for job displacement and other ills by people doing labor arbitrage in the united states, it eventually turned out that wet sidewalks did not cause rain, and now there are a bunch of underemployed kids stuck with fake dreams and real loans and a bunch of rich boomers+billionaires whose brokerage accounts depend on continuing the hustle. Given that we have seen the exact education-cures-all narrative inversion exploited to disastrous consequence in the United States, we should absolutely be asking the question "is education the active ingredient" to avoid exporting the same stupid mistake to others.

colechristensen 42 minutes ago | parent [-]

[flagged]

jstummbillig 3 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

Or, potentially, you have less time to marry (among other things) when you go to school?

nomel 18 minutes ago | parent [-]

No, it's not a scheduling conflict. A child getting married is entirely about if the parents choose to force that child to be married or not. They were less motivated to marry the child, if the child was going to school, because an education is an alternative path to gain moneys, which is the parents primary motive. It's interesting how disgusting greed like this is wrapped in words, like "culture" that try to make it ok. It's a repugnant behavior, which is why there was effort to correct it, and we're reading about it here.

malfist 10 minutes ago | parent [-]

A parent's primary motive is not to gain money, much less to gain money by exploiting their child.

lotsofpulp 3 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

> Basically there is social pressure to marry early if you’re not occupied in some way or have less prospects for employment after education.

The way this is phrased makes it seem like the children are making the choice to marry.

shermantanktop 3 hours ago | parent | next [-]

Many traditional cultures have a communitarian approach to decision-making. What an individual wants is often a small part of the equation, especially for girls and women.

That doesn’t sit well for a western individualist mindset but… it happens there too. Parental pressure in particular is the conduit for broader social norms.

tolerance 2 hours ago | parent [-]

I'm here to make somebody feel old: The Graduate (1967) came out almost 60 years ago. I wonder how long the norms portrayed in that film persisted or have evolved since then.

stickfigure an hour ago | parent [-]

They nailed the plastics thing.

Barbing an hour ago | parent | prev | next [-]

Can offer one read:

> Basically there is social pressure to marry early if you’re not occupied in some way or have less prospects for employment after education.

“Basically if you are a kid your friends/family will want you to get married if your friends/family notice you are unemployed/not in school/etc.”

(The desires of the kid were not referenced.)

fsckboy 2 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

I had no idea where you got your interpretation from, then I realized it was lack of interpretation.

the social pressure is traditional society on families, and then elders in families exert significant pressure on younger dependents, not to mention the strong economic pressure of nonproductive mouths to feed in circumstances without significant surpluses. It's exactly how westerners lived a century ago so it should not appear mysterious.

coryrc 3 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

> simply stating "stayed in school" feels like an oversimplification of what was done here

> Am I misunderstanding something here?

"Stayed in school" is a clear, binary condition that's easily measured and has obvious benefits to everyone because everyone is at least a little educated.

If I ask you "is your house temperature livable?" and you say "the thermometer says 20", answered. You didn't say "well, I purchased and installed a heat pump and duct distribution system capable of forcing warmed air to be distributed to the remainder of the house, which keeps the temperature in a habitable range, then ensured power supply remains connected and kept it on" and say I didn't really explain the important part.

nerdjon 3 hours ago | parent [-]

Except that your example is a simple conversation vs explaining the outcome of a study/program. That immediately requires more information to actually convey what did and did not happen.

For example, I could read the actual details on this and possibly determine that they replace school with some other (cheaper) program that just keeps the girls busy.

Or I could determine that all we really need to do is launch an outreach marketing program encouraging that girls stay in school and ignore all of the other support that was given.

One of those is supported by the headline and one is supported by the lack of information about what actually helped.

If by your example there was a study on how we made a previously unlivable area, suitable for humans in their homes but all it said was "well the temperature is X" than you would have questions on how exactly that was achieved.

Same with living in space, if NASA told us that the way astronauts are living on the space station with "well there is oxygen" we wouldn't accept that because there is obviously more going on.

Wanting to actually know what the full picture is allows us to reproduce it.

rrr_oh_man 33 minutes ago | parent | prev | next [-]

Reminds me of a uni project I did.

Using official Kenyan government statistics (back when Open Data was en vogue) for school attendance and access to sanitation, we tried to find out whether there's a correlation between school attendance of kids and their access to different types of sanitation (ranging from "flush toilet connected to main sewer" to "out in the bush"). We titled the project "Happy Butts, Happy Pupils". [0]

Learning 1: Districts with better sanitation have higher school attendance.

Learning 2: "VIP latrine" is a very funny and (unintentionally?) fitting name.

[0] TL;DR for anyone interested: https://drive.google.com/file/d/1Y5szIPCOnL4pyu67wu1MTRw8KSA...

philipallstar an hour ago | parent | prev | next [-]

Yes - it's correlation from the factors you mentioned.

saidnooneever 3 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

not familiar with nigera perse but in most places with child marriage, the marriage is the reason girls drop out of school.

other then that often its financial reasons. they will put boys to school because those are classically expected to take care of the family while girl will be married off to some guy. (ofc this is changing in a lot of places bits its the historical reasons afaik)

alephnerd 2 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

> Am I misunderstanding something here?

No, you are right - especially in Northern Nigeria.

Northern Nigeria is in the midst of a protracted Islamist insurgency by Al Qaeda and ISIS where jihadis have often targeted government institutions like schools and kidnapped and subsequently assaulted and trafficked female students, such as in Chibok [0], Papiri [1], and Kebbi [2].

Marriage is viewed from an economic and safety lens in these kinds of communities - if education can provide both then a girl can continue to be educated. If not, marriage is the easiest solution.

This Pathways program had added security monitoring that reduced the risk of girls potentially being made a "war bride" (ie. sex slave) by a jihadist, and never to see their family again, which incentivized families to continue to support their daughters education instead of deciding to marry them off early.

[0] - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chibok_schoolgirls_kidnapping

[1] - https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/c3w7621xypyo

[2] - https://www.nytimes.com/2025/11/17/world/africa/nigeria-scho...

3 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]
[deleted]
whalesalad 2 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

Yes this is the classical correlation vs causation situation.

bell-cot 3 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

> Am I misunderstanding ...

NO. I've seen quite a few things, across many cultures, pointing out that girls being any combination of low-value, low-status, and unsupported leads to them ending up as "cheap bodies".

That includes several American women friends, whose life stories include getting married at age 17-ish - because, with the situations in their own families, that really looked like their least-bad option.

bcjdjsndon 3 hours ago | parent [-]

Cant you still marry a child in some american states? Isn't this a bit like the pot calling the kettle black?

skissane 27 minutes ago | parent | next [-]

It isn’t just about the letter of the law, it is also about judicial attitudes-two countries can have the same law on paper, but with radically different applications in practice, to the point that it isn’t really the same law.

Yes, in many US states, someone under 18 can legally marry with the permission of a judge. And if the applicant is a pregnant 17 year old who wishes to marry her 17 year old boyfriend so their child isn’t “born out of wedlock”, a lot of judges will say “yes”. But if the applicant is a father who says “I think my 12 year old daughter is old enough to get married, and I found her a husband I like”, no way in hell is any American judge approving that, even if the letter of the law says they could.

But in some other countries, there are judges who would be happy to give that marriage official permission.

garciasn 3 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

Yes; it's currently legal in 34 US States. Here are the 16 that ban the practice: Delaware, New Jersey, Pennsylvania, Minnesota, Rhode Island, New York, Massachusetts, Vermont, Connecticut, Michigan, Washington, Virginia, New Hampshire, Maine, Oregon, and Missouri.

In Nigeria, nearly 40% of all girls are wed by 18 between 2000 and 2019 (https://childmarriagedata.org/country-profiles/nigeria/#comp...), whereas there were a total of less than 300K American girls in child marriages between 2000 and 2018.

ajkjk 3 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

not if you also condemn the American states that allow that...

bell-cot 3 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

Pretty much "yes" - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Marriage_age_in_the_United_Sta...

I'd guess your pot/kettle comment is something nationalist/political? My prior comment was trying to say it's universal, not some "country X is good/bad" dig.

jonahx 3 hours ago | parent [-]

See garciasn's sibling comment to yours.

Degree matters. A lot. Saying "it's universal" because there is some frequency everywhere is misleading. There are many country Xs that absolutely deserve to be called out as bad, because they are relatively so much worse than the best countries, or even the average ones.

bell-cot an hour ago | parent [-]

My intent: "it's universal" means the correlation between girls being low-value and child marriages is universal.

Your seeming reading: "it's universal" means child marriage occurs in every country...but that is a huge tactical mistake to say, because it gets in the way of us condemning countries where the problem is much worse than in ours.

My concern is for the girls, not for scoring point for condemning countries. To actually help the girls, the article seems to provide a proven solution. So let's do more of what works.

Vs. what is the track record for major non-aligned nations (like Nigeria) implementing progressive social reforms at scale, in response to moral condemnation by foreigners? That I've heard of, not good.