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mcoliver 5 hours ago

I've seen this at so many startups (and worked to patch the gaps and put in best practices) including those backed by top tier VCs. The problem is that it is rare for startups to have security minded people.

It's usually designers, people who can raise money, and generalists who can stitch together apis. It's not generally platform, db, or security minded people. The proliferation of things like vercel and supabase have exacerbated this.

So you get people deploying API keys client side and dbs without rls. Or deploying service keys client side when they should be anon. I mean really basic stuff.

The_Blade 4 hours ago | parent | next [-]

> So you get people deploying API keys client side and dbs without rls. Or deploying service keys client side when they should be anon. I mean really basic stuff.

Claude Code will do this, and actively encourage bypassing any verification before pushing to prod. I saw that first hand with its attempted handling of a major CIAM provider, and then Vercel using whatever OAuth provider in the ol' transitive breach

That is common knowledge now, right? Or am I just smoking yellow tops

fragmede an hour ago | parent [-]

Yeah but Supabase yells really loudly if you have RLS turned off with their own AI agent, plus you can ask Claude to red team the platform to have it lock it down.

throwaway523401 8 minutes ago | parent | prev | next [-]

I used to work at a startup that handled medical records. A HIPAA breach would have wiped out the company through reputation damage — because our customers were also subject to HIPAA and couldn't possibly hire a startup with a track record of HIPAA breaches.

In my personal assessment some individuals within leadership at this startup were highly risk-tolerant. I speculate that had those individuals been in leadership at other companies not subject to HIPAA, security practices would have been as lax and irresponsible as what's being described as the norm in this thread.

However, because of HIPAA, security practices at this company were fair-to-middling. There were certainly weak areas and mindless box-checking a la SOC-2, but it wasn't a complete shitshow. Those of us in the engineering deparment who cared were able to raise concerns and not have them dismissed, and were generally allowed to do things the right way, at least internally.

My takeaway: when there are actual severe penalties for privacy breaches, startups may not be so cavalier with your data.

chrisss395 2 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

In your opinion, is the lack of attention on security due to speed-bias or not having the expertise? For a startup / sole entrepreneur with very limited resources, what would be your advice?

hansvm 23 minutes ago | parent [-]

IME it's always lack of experience, at least at the level being described here. It's the same kind of person adding CORS handling to a pure backend service for "security" reasons. They just don't know any better and don't have a good enough mental model of how it all fits together to be able to recognize when they need to research more. The insecure patterns being chosen instead usually aren't even easier or faster to implement.

I don't have any concrete recommendations other than that one really good senior+ engineer is more important than a legion of juniors early on. Basic security doesn't require an extra hire; it requires somebody experienced enough to build your product right.

BowBun 4 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

Yep, this has been my experience over 15 years in startups as well. There are barely any punishments, so there is no incentive for startups to change how they operate.

bigyabai 3 hours ago | parent | next [-]

Same here. I've witnessed horrifying security bugs that were basically flagged as WONTFIX internally because it was too much work to fix until it was exploited.

cyanydeez 4 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

You could even say they're paid even more to "move fast and break things".

c2h5oh 4 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

More often than not security minded people are encouraged to focus on things that get the product to market faster instead.