> Having kids is a financial and ecological disaster. As an outside observer it's remarkable to me people are still having any kids at all, which speaks to the strong subjective factors overpowering whatever objective considerations one might have about it.

Objectively if no-one has kids then there will be no more humans. I guess you could consider that an ecological win. If you don't, then someone has to have kids.

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thrownthatway 6 hours ago | parent [-]

No, there will be plenty of Hindus and Muslims, cos they largely don’t give a fuck about any of this noise.

But Christianity and Western Civilisation can kiss its own arse goodbye if it thinks this is a reasonable ideology to instil in to its young people.

Don’t have kids because it’ll economically ruin your life, and it’s bad for the environment anyway.

Righteo then, get on ya spaceship n fuck off to Mars then. Free up some resources and economy for us who believe having a family is the most important thing humans can do and that Western civilisation is actually pretty neat!

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inglor_cz 6 hours ago | parent [-]

"No, there will be plenty of Hindus and Muslims, cos they largely don’t give a fuck about any of this noise."

Have you looked at the TFRs in India and more developed Muslim countries lately?

Mostly under 2 and still dropping like a stone. Turkey, Iran or UAE are every bit as much on the road to disastrous demography as Europe is, only with some delay.

Does not surprise me... in both Europe and East Asia, the worst and deepest drops in fertility happened in previously very socially conservative societies (Spain, South Korea), while the trend was less sharp and sudden in, say, Scandinavia.

	▲	thrownthatway 5 hours ago \| parent [-]
		Well fuck hey. Israel may be mankind’s only hope. As far as I’m aware Israel is the only developed Western nation with a fertility rate above replacement. Of course, it’s more nuanced than that. Definitely seems to be a positive correlation between religiosity and fertility rate.