This type of system is a horrible idea for the following reasons:

1) the cards can just be re-sold which creates a black market and defeats the "cashier physically saw the person buying the card" angle

2) nickle and dimes people for simply browsing the internet (verification can dystopia anyone?)

3) related to #2, it creates winners in the private sector since presumably you need central authorities handing out these codes

I abhor the idea of digital ID verification, but if we're going to do it, let's not create a web of new problems while we're at it.

▲

arowthway 5 hours ago | parent | next [-]

Is it even theoretically possible to have bearer anonymity and no reselling option at the same time?

	▲	terangaway 4 hours ago \| parent [-]
		With digital tokens being generated by a user (the seller) on demand, you could have a bond system where the seller places something costly on the line, that the buyer can choose to destroy or obtain. For instance, if Alice gives her age token to Bob, Bob can (if he is a troll) invalidate the token in a way that requires Alice to go to a physical location to reset her ID. I imagine this could be done with appropriate zero-knowledge measures so that the combination of Alice's age token and Bob's private key creates a capability to exercise the option, but without the service (e.g. a social media site) knowing that the token belongs to Alice, and without the ID provider (e.g. the state) knowing that Bob was the one who exercised it. While honest customers have no reason to make use of this option, if Alice blindly sells her tokens to anybody willing to pay, there's bound to be some trolls out there who will do it just for the laughs. This is far from a perfect system since a dishonest site could also make use of the option. But it theoretically works without revealing anybody's identity (unless the option is used, and then only if the service and the ID provider collude).

▲

anonym29 5 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

First - Alcohol and cigarettes can just be resold too. The black market for them is effectively zero because the consequences for giving them to kids are severe and the room for meaningful profit is close to zero, same applies here.

Second - The codes would be priced on the order of magnitude of pennies per verification - think 10 cents or less, accessible even to low / fixed income folks without really making a dent in their budget.

Third - the proposal explicitly mentions a nonprofit running it as an option, and the idea would be that law codifies the method to be approved, not a specific vendor, so competitive markets could emerge, too. Would you argue that restrictions on the sale of alcohol are creating artificial winners in the private sector of alcohol manufacturing?

	▲	arowthway 5 hours ago \| parent \| next [-]
		'consequences for giving them to kids are severe and the room for meaningful profit is close to zero, same applies here.' I don't think it applies, the difference is that codes are digital and can be sold over the internet, anonymously, in a scallable manner. I still like this solution because all the solutions I've seen have flaws and this one being so easy to explain makes it great to campaign for.
	▲	hypeatei 5 hours ago \| parent \| prev [-]
		You're doing a huge logical jump in your first point. Alcohol and cigarettes are physical goods, digital ID is not, but you're proposing a system that turns it into a physical problem. I'm merely pointing out that's what you're doing and the issues with it. Second, it doesn't matter what it costs, it's inconvenient and I already spent time (possibly money too) obtaining a government ID... on top of a theoretical mandate that says I need to show the ID on a bunch of websites. Third, I'm not sure I follow your point on alcohol restrictions creating winners? The non-profit idea could potentially be good, but I'm not hopeful that real world legislation would be crafted that way. EDIT: also more on #1 and "severe consequences" for re-selling... yes that's exactly what we want to avoid: creating more reasons to put people in prison and a bigger burden on law enforcement and the court system.