| ▲ | WarmWash 6 hours ago |
| I'm one of the young(er) few who stuck with hardware out of passion rather than follow the comfortable allure of software that all my peers did. You make less money, often half. You need to commute to work. Work prospects are narrower and heavily military biased. You get exposed to harmful materials/chemicals. Hardware development is slow, tedious, and punishing compared to software. Having a home lab requires far far more than a laptop. Information is much more sparse so being around knowledgeable others is often critical. The industry is packed with grey beards, I'm often the youngest guy by 20 years in customer meetings. Maybe things will change now that we're in a period of uncertainty, but I see hardware as being a thing for the second world and unlikely to stage a big comeback. |
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| ▲ | drtz 4 hours ago | parent | next [-] |
| I left a career in RF and analog design about 15 years ago to go all-in on software. I liked technical aspects of hardware design, but the workplace culture was very lacking to say the least. Hopefully things have improved since then, but my perception at the time was that engineers in the field were paid and treated quite poorly compared to software engineers, despite having a significantly higher barrier to entry in engineering difficulty and technical knowledge. |
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| ▲ | TheBog 24 minutes ago | parent | prev | next [-] |
| A counter perspective, but I feel like the prospects are great for hardware engineers as the "gray beards" retire and leave a wide open lane (and need) for hardware expertise. |
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| ▲ | scruple 6 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-] |
| I started my career in embedded at an RF company. Back then, I was 20 years junior to the next oldest guy and he was 20 years junior to the rest of the engineers. It was an incredible place to start, learning from some crusty old veterans who were pushing into retirement age. I ultimately left because the pay wasn't there. I've often thought I'd love to go back, even if it meant a decrease in pay, because the environment was so rich with learning and experimenting. |
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| ▲ | UncleOxidant 3 hours ago | parent [-] | | I also started in embedded development at a company where there was a significant RF component (essentially, we were doing wireless networking in 1986 - like wifi about 10 years early). All of the digital & software folks were youngish - 20s, 30s. But the RF guys were all in their 50s or older. |
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| ▲ | GrumpyYoungMan 5 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-] |
| > "...stuck with hardware out of passion..." At least you don't hate your job, I hope? The recent maturation of AI revealed how many people in software seemingly loathe their own profession. |
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| ▲ | girvo 4 hours ago | parent | next [-] | | > The recent maturation of AI revealed how many people in software seemingly loathe their own profession. I always had an inkling this was the case, but man it's been depressing to see it laid so bare. So many proudly screaming "I hated programming!". Well, I don't, I love it, and have my entire life, and imagine I'll continue to as long as they will let me... More relevantly to the article and comment we're replying to: I miss doing firmware engineering. Gosh that is so much fun. | | |
| ▲ | qazxcvbnmlp 3 hours ago | parent | next [-] | | I can assure you the same thing is coming to fw and ee as well. If your in hw because you like building stuff its going to be a fun time to be alive, but there will be large chunks of engineering work that go away. | | |
| ▲ | girvo 3 hours ago | parent [-] | | Oh I'm well aware. It's lagging behind "pure" software, but is catching up. The only thing I can see that acts as a bulwark is liability, bascially. The FW work I was doing requires a human and a large amount of careful review before acceptance. The "throw slop at the wall" that my current job is okay with won't fly there. But there's _lots_ of FW jobs in consumer gear that is already filled with god awful slop, so maybe it won't take as long as I think. | | |
| ▲ | sitzkrieg 2 hours ago | parent [-] | | i’m sure all auditing and qa reasons for human in the loop firmware development will magically go poof soon as well |
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| ▲ | mschuster91 3 hours ago | parent | prev [-] | | > I always had an inkling this was the case, but man it's been depressing to see it laid so bare. So many proudly screaming "I hated programming!". For personal stuff? Sure. But I certainly get why people get burned out on corporate programming. It's either tedious busywork following orders designed by architects whose last time writing code was 30 years ago and they never learned anything ever since, waterfall with glaring issues that the lowest rungs are supposed to magically make go away because upper management doesn't want to reset like they're supposed to, or it's "agile" in its various abominations. There's barely any time, budget or possibility left for actually experimenting a bit or for actually crafting out stuff that works. It's all output, output, output, and being micromanaged by Jira or whatever only adds to the dissatisfaction. Personally, I left the field for good - I'm heading towards electrical engineering. Good luck coding a robot pulling physical wires. |
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| ▲ | mcmcmc 28 minutes ago | parent | prev | next [-] | | I think you’re kidding yourself if you think the majority of software engineers are in it for anything other than the money. | |
| ▲ | bikelang 3 hours ago | parent | prev [-] | | And then there’s those of us that loved writing software and loathe what AI has reduced it to. | | |
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| ▲ | chromacity 4 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-] |
| There's always the Juiceros of the world. More seriously, every software company of note has some hardware aspirations and hires some number of EEs, machinists, material scientists, etc. Not as many as SWEs, but if you can get your foot in the door, it's probably nice. |
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| ▲ | teleforce 3 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-] |
| > I see hardware as being a thing for the second world and unlikely to stage a big comeback. I cannot disagree more. Actually the synergy of software and hardware (primarily due to the increasing popularity of electromagnetics EM spectrums sensing like Radar/LIDAR/mmWave/THz/etc compared to sound) will create unprecedented beyond human perception and intelligence embodied and enhanced by physical AI. Heck the EXG sensings including ECG/EMG/EEG/etc that are technically part of EM, are now generating hundreds of papers/patents/articles everyday in which this product/patent/paper by Meta and its subsidiary CTRL-labs is only the tip of the iceberg [1],[2]. Please check my other comments for more contexts. [1] A generic non-invasive neuromotor interface for human-computer interaction (Nature article): https://www.nature.com/articles/s41586-025-09255-w [2] Meta Ray-Ban Display (2025 - 962 comments): https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=45283306 |
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| ▲ | markus_zhang 6 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-] |
| I kinda want to join such a company as a software guy, but I really can’t take a 50% pay cut. This is really sad! Have always wanted to work at places that can grow very solid engineering cultures. |
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| ▲ | amelius 5 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-] |
| Curious if it's the same in China. We forgot how to make things, and maybe we're now forgetting how to do RF engineering. Those grey beards will retire at some point. |
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| ▲ | mikestorrent 2 hours ago | parent [-] | | And now we're actively making this worse by not hiring juniors to learn from us while we're still able to take on apprentices. What could go wrong? |
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| ▲ | uejfiweun 6 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-] |
| These all sound like factors that make hardware a better long-term prospect to build a career around. Basically every single thing you just mentioned makes the field more resistant to automation. |
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| ▲ | 0xffff2 6 hours ago | parent | next [-] | | Except for "You make less money, often half.", which is a hell of a pill to swallow. As someone ~10 years into my software career, I'm pretty confident that even if I got laid off tomorrow and never found work as an engineer again, I'd still be better off now than if I had stuck with ME or EE as I originally planned. | |
| ▲ | dublinstats 6 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-] | | I think the real deciding factor is government policy. So far they have favored software and services companies, letting them eat the lunch of the hardware producers. | | |
| ▲ | WarmWash 3 hours ago | parent [-] | | The reality is that software is valued like it is hardware, but has a teeny fraction of the input costs and running costs. The government didn't have to do anything, investors naturally ran to the software "copy+paste" money printer. Build it once with only labor costs and then copy for nothing infinite times. To build a $100M software company you need 5 capable friends and a cloud account. To build a $100M hardware company you need $500M. | | |
| ▲ | dublinstats 2 hours ago | parent [-] | | The government heavily revised and reinterpreted patent law many times in favor of software companies starting in the 80s. Otherwise hardware companies would have the only real moat since, as you say, software is relatively cheap and fast to produce. |
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| ▲ | high_priest 6 hours ago | parent | prev [-] | | There are far too many Asian electronic engineers for NA or EU based craftsmen to gain easy living.
You have to make a viral product and find a way to satiate the demand, to find similar success to software & AI bros. |
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| ▲ | CamperBob2 3 hours ago | parent | prev [-] |
| What sort of 'harmful materials and chemicals' are we talking about? |
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| ▲ | mikestorrent 2 hours ago | parent [-] | | I used to work at a place that had a factory that made cryogenically-freezable circuit boards. I only had to visit from time to time... It was a crazy 1980s legacy place with ancient machines and weird vats of weird smelling chemicals all over the place for etching and finishing. No idea whether they were harmful or not, nobody seemed to need any PPE though.... |
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