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▲ simonw 4 days ago

What's the grift?

By "rebuke" do you mean the thing where they didn't send any of their execs to be a guest on his WWDC podcast episode, presumably in retribution for his "Something Is Rotten in the State of Cupertino" post?

I don't see how that makes him irrelevant - I think it strengthens his credibility as someone willing to hold Apple accountable when he disagrees with their direction.

▲colesantiago 4 days ago | parent | next [-]

Apple prefers tech influencers / YouTubers like Marques Brownlee and the like who actually resonate with audiences (and don't harp on about Trump every week) rather than irrelevant bloggers.

> I don't see how that makes him irrelevant - I think it strengthens his credibility as someone willing to hold Apple accountable when he disagrees with their direction.

???

Accountable to what? Do you actually think Apple cares now about a random blogger who makes a living critiquing them?

That is the grift and by the looks of it I would say he is irrelevant since Apple declined his invitation.

Gruber needs Apple more than Apple needs him.

▲simonw 4 days ago | parent [-]

> Do you actually think Apple cares now about a random blogger who makes a living critiquing them?

Yes.

I mean, they clearly care enough to pull their execs from his podcast supposedly in response to something he wrote.

So is "the grift" the fact that he makes a living writing a blog? Who are the victims of this particular grift?

▲LatencyKills 4 days ago | parent | prev [-]

[flagged]

▲simonw 4 days ago | parent | next [-]

Why should my opinion of how credible he is as a writer about Apple be affected by people who work at Apple not liking him?

▲LatencyKills 4 days ago | parent [-]

Because there are very specific reasons why people (who actually know his relationship to Apple) don't view him as credible. I don't know how else to communicate that point.

▲colesantiago 4 days ago | parent [-]

[flagged]

▲simonw 4 days ago | parent [-]

I have genuinely no idea how I'm sealioning here.

The answer to my question appears to be "it's a secret, I'll tell you in private, everyone at Apple thinks like this".

I know at least one person who works at Apple who respects Gruber, so I'm already suspicious of the confidence being expressed here.

▲colesantiago 4 days ago | parent | next [-]

This person is more credible than your unknown source and he knows many that doesn't like Gruber.

and Simon you're a indie journalist, why don't you contact him and find out?

▲LatencyKills 4 days ago | parent | prev [-]

> The answer to my question appears to be "it's a secret, I'll tell you in private, everyone at Apple thinks like this".

Because that is the truth. I have no intention of sharing confidential information publicly.

Your take is "someone won't betray their previous employer publicly, so they must be lying."

I offered to share my thoughts, work experience, and other details with you privately. I've lost all respect for you as a journalist.

▲simonw 4 days ago | parent [-]

Before I spend time talking to someone I like to be reasonably confident that it's going to be a valuable conversation. The vibes aren't great here.

▲LatencyKills 4 days ago | parent [-]

What "vibes"? I do NOT like John as a person. That has no bearing on whether or not what I'm claiming is true.

I was an engineer at both Microsoft and Apple. I have extensive experience at both companies in how we shared information with 3rd parties and how we intentionally cultivated those relationships for specific purposes.

I'm currently building an interesting tool for macOS that Claude can't build on its own. I was considering reaching out to you because I was certain you'd find Claude's responses interesting. It is mind-boggling that this is how you interact with people publicly.

▲simonw 4 days ago | parent [-]

The vibes of starting a thread with "You've never met a more conceited asshole", followed by attacking my credibility with "you have absolutely no idea what you are talking about" and "I am supremely disappointed in your comments here" purely because I asked "what's the grift?".

It was mainly the "I am supremely disappointed in your comments here" thing that put me off, I didn't see how that was a reasonable response to what I had commented in this thread.

▲LatencyKills 4 days ago | parent [-]

> "You've never met a more conceited asshole"

Again, you'd be hard-pressed to find an Apple engineer who has spent any in-person time with John who doesn't have a similar take.

> "you have absolutely no idea what you are talking about"

There is nothing in this thread, aside from your supposed "friend", that makes me believe you've had any direct contact with Apple employees who know anything about John's relationship with Apple. So, in this specific instance, I have no reason to believe you know what you are talking about.

Lastly, I'm not the one who pointed out any grift. My point was that John's relationship to Apple is complicated.

You are communicating with someone who helped build two of the most popular development tools of all time, and yet you continue to act like you are above us, poor HN commenters. I've offered to discuss things with you privately (which is the right thing to do, since I have no intention of hurting Apple), and you've ignored it. Anyone who has access to information and yet refuses to engage is not a journalist.

▲simonw 4 days ago | parent [-]

Would you still like me to email you? I don't have time for a conversation today (mainly because I'm not a journalist and have software I need to ship) but I can contact you if you think it would be productive.

▲LatencyKills 4 days ago | parent [-]

I am more than happy to have a conversation. I am more than happy to share my experiences with John. I am more than happy to talk about some of the things we did at Apple (and MS) to "help" certain stories reach the right people. We definitely handled John differently than people like David Pogue or Jason Snell.

I'm also happy to show you a demo of my app (built without AI assistance) that Claude has repeatedly failed to replicate because it requires architectural knowledge that SOTA models still aren't able to turn into a comprehensive solution. That is very different from building a web browser from scratch.

If none of that interests you, then no, there is no need to reach out.

▲jmull 4 days ago | parent | prev [-]

The comment asks what’s the grift? How is he irrelevant?

You ignore the questions and respond with ad hominem attacks.

Obviously, you’ve got a beef with Gruber. That’s fine. But you’re acquitting yourself well here (and make us suspect that whatever happened between you and Gruber, you might have had a significant hand in it).

▲LatencyKills 4 days ago | parent [-]

[flagged]

▲simonw 4 days ago | parent [-]

How does he get paid by Apple?

I thought he earned his living from $11,000/week blog sponsors and whatever he earns from the podcast.

If Apple are paying him to cover them then yes, that's a grift. Is that happening?

(I know they send him review hardware because he discloses that in his posts.)

▲LatencyKills 4 days ago | parent [-]

As I said, this is not something I will discuss publicly. But what I can say is that Apple wouldn't be the first tech company to pay for certain stories to be written, as I'm sure you're aware. There was a time when Apple needed John (along with his apparent "unbiased" takes). John's blog was critical for a period of time.

▲replwoacause 4 days ago | parent [-]

I found this exchange both entertaining and informative. Appreciate you sharing an insider's perspective (while also acknowledging I have no possible way to verify if any of this is even true).

▲LatencyKills 4 days ago | parent [-]

Heh... thanks. I don't expect anyone to just believe this information verbatim; as you said, I'm just some rando on HN. But I did offer to discuss it privately with @simonw.