Google has so far allowed installing apps without their explicit permission. So it's much higher on freedom index, imo. And there's no obligation to use Google cloud apps. There's alternative for every Google cloud app.

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modeless 3 days ago | parent [-]

Also, Pixels have unlocked bootloaders and Android is open source to the point where third parties can and do make alternative OS distributions.

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cwillu 3 days ago | parent [-]

And it's necessary to have a second phone to actually use any of that while maintaining access to one's banking app.

The hardware is nominally open only because they enforce participation in their software ecosystem via other means.

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DANmode 2 days ago | parent | next [-]

> And it's necessary to have a second phone to actually use any of that while maintaining access to one's banking app.

Partially accurate / misleading at most.

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cwillu 2 days ago | parent [-]

I have a phone that can be unlocked, and I will lose access to my banking app (among other things I require) if I do so.

If your “partially accurate” objection is that I didn't describe a perfectly universal experience, I will be greatly disappointed.

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DANmode 2 days ago | parent | next [-]

Vouching your comment from dead to reply in good faith:

your bank’s app sucks, tell them they suck,

and or use the webapp.

Tens of thousands of financial institution apps work A-OK on GrapheneOS,

that is my objection.

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hedora 2 days ago | parent [-]

That’s good to know. Is there a list? Maybe a vocal community of computer literate people with money could loudly move to banks that do work (regardless of which phone they have).

	▲	DANmode 2 days ago \| parent [-]
		Apps with Google SafetyNet usage, and or Google Pay NFC dependency to start the app, two common failure modes.

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DANmode 2 days ago | parent | prev [-]

What does “unlocked” mean, here?

Are we talking about root checks? Bootloader unlock?

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whatsupdog 2 days ago | parent | prev [-]

That's like saying there's no freedom in USA because I didn't get a visa to visit. We are talking about the freedom of Google devices. And you are talking about banks not letting you install their apps on a non Google OS. Totally different things.