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eightysixfour 6 days ago

This isn’t a contest for most just or most evil. Iran has committed horrible atrocities. The US’s approach to this war has been completely wrong and they are threatening war crimes.

Everyone sucks here.

Fricken 6 days ago | parent | next [-]

Yeah but western powers have been threatening, bullying, murdering and undermining Iran and it's people since they nationalized their own damn oil three quarters of a century ago.

How do you expect an abused dog to turn out? It's probably not going to turn out very nice isn't it? The Iranian regime would chill out just fine on their own if only the west would stop being so cruel to them.

aogaili 6 days ago | parent | next [-]

That's exactly it, and what's more they are kicking the abused dog even harder expecting submission. At this stage, it seems it would rather die or push the abuser away.

UltraSane 6 days ago | parent | prev [-]

Iran has been "threatening, bullying, murdering and undermining" Israel since it was taken over by an irrational Shia theocracy. This war wouldn't be happening if Iran had behaved in a sane and rational manner over the last 35 years.

aogaili a day ago | parent [-]

By rational you mean accept the British, US and Israeli rule and the "liberal" democracy of give up your military and give us your oil and market.

rixed 6 days ago | parent | prev | next [-]

So one side is evil while the other side is just wrong ?

Like after 300k deaths in Irak when the administration said "sorry we have been misled by wrong information about the WMD"? They made a mistake, yet Iraqis were evil.

aogaili 6 days ago | parent | prev | next [-]

US armed rebels, that is their history, Israel wants to the current government down at all cost.

They did that with Iraq, ISIS, they trying with Kurdistan..

I'm not defending a theocracy, but this is not how countries are freed. And he is clearly claiming to take the oil, destroy their infrastructure and take the country to the dark ages. If Iranian government was saying that, hell would go lose.

AuthAuth 6 days ago | parent | next [-]

Actually arming rebels is how countries are freed. Its not the only way but it is one of the most common. Also Iran arms rebels so whats your point in highlighting the US support for rebel groups?

aogaili 6 days ago | parent | next [-]

Your perspective on who is being liberated and who is doing the liberating relies on a simplistic narrative. Ironically, the central figure of that narrative, Donald Trump, has openly stated that he does not mind seizing oil or returning the nation to the Dark Ages. Furthermore, they have backed armed protests and expressed a willingness to arm Kurdish factions.

I am uncertain about the logic or framework you are utilizing. If you believe such actions constitute "freeing" a country, then we clearly do not share the same moral and ethical standards.

AuthAuth 6 days ago | parent [-]

I think you're assuming way to much from my comment. I was pushing back on the idea that arming rebel group isnt how countries are freed not supporting what Trump is doing.

A violent takeover may not immediately lead to a "free" country but it does open the doors to change and from that change can come freedom. Or in a different perspective its not freedom its just to be free from that certain regime.

hackable_sand 5 days ago | parent [-]

We should punctuate the difference between self-actualization and liberal colonization.

I'm not Iranian, Iran has no effect on my life, and I'm a pacifist.

Why would I compel someone to liberate themselves with a mistaken paternalism? It's irresponsible.

AuthAuth 5 days ago | parent [-]

because the person funding isnt doing it out of the good of their heart. They have interests in removing the current government. The rebels also have interests in removing the current government. That is all its just two people working together on a common goal its not that deep.

aogaili 5 days ago | parent [-]

Since Iran is clearly seeking to remove the U.S. government, is arming democratic factions a morally justifiable response?

skandinaff 5 days ago | parent | prev [-]

So, does that mean that Kremlin is freeing a country..?

linkregister 6 days ago | parent | prev | next [-]

The origin of the United States hinged on its rebellion being armed by the French monarchy.

defrost 6 days ago | parent [-]

which directly led in no small way to the overthrow of the French monarchy.

Perhaps US involvemet in arming rebels elsewhere might led to the downfall of the current US ruling class also?

_DeadFred_ 6 days ago | parent | prev [-]

Iran has been saying this about Israel and the USA since 1979 and has been arming/propping up Hamas, Hezbollah, and the Houthis, who have has similar language on their flags/in their charters.

nashashmi 6 days ago | parent | prev | next [-]

Keep in mind that we now know that US supplied the protestors weapons to wage violence during the crackdown that resulted in many police officers being killed. We also know that the US has run a campaign to turn protests into riots in past events. And we know that the US sponsors campaigns to create unrest in the country.

If Iran sucks, it is only because the US wants it to suck

aogaili 6 days ago | parent | next [-]

That's exactly it. They admitted supplying anti-government rebels with weapons.

Imagine a country comes and arm a group in the US to rebel against the government..

Dumblydorr 6 days ago | parent | prev | next [-]

The USA didn’t turn Iran into a terrorist Jihadist state attempting to get nukes. Not everything is the USA’s doing, give extremely violent Islam its fault as well.

nashashmi 6 days ago | parent | next [-]

Iran is not a jihadist nor a nuke state. The US attempted to isolate Iran from the world, and tried to make everyone its enemy.

_DeadFred_ 6 days ago | parent [-]

Iran has funded/stood up Hamas, Hezbollah, and Houthi rebels whose flags and charters include maximalist jihadist rhetoric. Iran my entire life has pushed 'death to America'. When Iran's leadership was killed they talked about welcoming it and Islamic martyrdom. My entire life that is my exposure to what an Islamic state looks like. Sure seems jihadist to me.

nashashmi 6 days ago | parent | next [-]

The only thing those groups have in common is their hate for israel. And israel has intentionally made them the enemy. As it has done with Iran. And blackmailed trump to go after Iran.

At this point you simply just back away from all indications of “iran bad”

aogaili 6 days ago | parent | prev [-]

[dead]

Hikikomori 6 days ago | parent | prev [-]

They certainly gave them a very hard push in that direction due to their coup in 1953. Do you also think 9/11 happened because of US freedom?

gcanyon 6 days ago | parent | prev [-]

Wait, cites on the "US supplied Iranian protestors with weapons" bit? Other than Trump? It sounds ridiculous to question whether he's telling the truth, but here we are...

aogaili 6 days ago | parent [-]

Are you suggesting I provide a citation for the President's claims? Beyond his reputation as a loose cannon, it is difficult to fathom why he would boast about such a thing.

From the beginning, the primary objective of this conflict has been for Israel to eliminate regional resistance, leaving Iran as the final holdout. By arming internal rebels to oppose the administration, external forces are essentially inciting a civil war to topple the government.

While the nation and its current leadership require reform, it is important to remember that these radical regimes do not emerge in a vacuum. Their perceived need to resist stems from external efforts to dismantle them. Such radicalization is often the direct consequence of aggressive policies, including economic sanctions, historical support for Saddam Hussein, and the installation of corrupt monarchies.

Every radical movement triggers a counter-movement, making it difficult to distinguish cause from effect. Much like the chills and fever associated with the flu, these movements represent an extreme but instinctive immune response to an outside threat.

gcanyon 4 days ago | parent [-]

[dead]

vintermann 6 days ago | parent | prev [-]

Are they committing war crimes?