The US has lost mutiple KC-125 tankers and an E3 as well, although those were destroyed ont he ground rather than shot down.

building all of this military infrastructure at the expense of living conditions for its people

Just yesterday, Trump was talking about another $1.5 trillion for defense in the coming fiscal year, and saying the US can't afford things like daycare, medicare etc.

Iran's military budget as a % of GDP has historically been inthe low single digits: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Military_budget_of_Iran

▲ ericmay 5 hours ago | parent | next [-]

> The US has lost mutiple KC-125 tankers and an E3 as well, although those were destroyed ont he ground rather than shot down.

Which makes them irrelevant here in this discussion but sure yea. Russia (those sneaky guys who invaded Ukraine and are being supplied by Iran) provide targeting information to Iran, Iran has missiles, we can't shoot them all down, and here we are. It's unfortunate but that's what happens in a war. Frankly, these are very good lessons learned by the United States and they're going to come in handy if we end up in another war.

> Just yesterday, Trump was talking about another $1.5 trillion for defense in the coming fiscal year, and saying the US can't afford things like daycare, medicare etc.

We can easily afford both, but we choose not to because our political system is full of morons and corruption, but instead of Iran being more like the US and being dysfunctional in this regard, it should be more like Norway (excluding population differences) and pump and sell the oil and do so for the benefit of their citizens instead of this authoritarian rah rah death to America and death to Israel nonsense.

> Iran's military budget as a % of GDP has historically been inthe low single digits:

Figures provided here are inaccurate and don't account for spending on proxy groups, for example.

▲ ElProlactin 4 hours ago | parent | next [-]

> Frankly, these are very good lessons learned by the United States and they're going to come in handy if we end up in another war.

This is an interesting take given that the US seems to have ignored many of the most important lessons from Vietnam, Iraq, Afghanistan, etc.

As for "end up in another war", the language you chose is very revealing. You don't just "end up in...war". Wars don't start themselves. Someone starts them and in the case of the US, it's almost always the US.

▲ ericmay 3 hours ago | parent [-]

> This is an interesting take given that the US seems to have ignored many of the most important lessons from Vietnam, Iraq, Afghanistan, etc.

This is a fun trope that's parroted but none of these wars were the same or even really close to each other in goals.

Vietnam - actually has great relations with the US and we won the peace.

Iraq - well they had Saddam and now they have a functioning parliament and things seem to be going a lot better for them. Was it worth $1.5 trillion of US spend to achieve that? That's a better question.

Afghanistan - We wanted to provide schooling for little girls and stuff like that and, well, the population didn't want it. So at some point you cut your losses.

Iran - We're not going to like invade and occupy Iran, though we could. We're just going to have to keep blowing up their military capabilities until they have a more reasonable government.

> As for "end up in another war", the language you chose is very revealing. You don't just "end up in...war". Wars don't start themselves. Someone starts them and in the case of the US, it's almost always the US.

It was just a figure of speech - Ukraine wound up in a war.

The US usually starts the war because the US is the only country in the world actually trying to do anything about nefarious actors. Easy to criticize from the sidelines, which is why American foreign policy has shifted to - we don't care what militarily irrelevant countries think about our activities because, well, we don't and they don't matter and we don't really care what they think. It sounds bad, but if we just retreat to isolationism as the MAGA and far-left crowds want, well maybe Iran goes and builds 5x the missile capabilities we have now, then they close the straight, force the gulf states to capitulate, and now you've got a nuclear armed Iranian regime in control of 20% of the world's oil supply. Oh and now you have nobody there to save you because China isn't going to go sail boats over there and bomb Iran, and Europe certainly isn't. Now what do you do?

▲ lostlogin 2 hours ago | parent | next [-]

> we don't care what militarily irrelevant countries think about our activities because, well, we don't and they don't matter and we don't really care what they think.

Why is the US pleading and whining for help then?

▲ stickfigure 3 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

Also, let's not forget that most of the people responsible for murdering ten thousand protesters a few weeks ago are now dead. No matter what else happens in this war, that is an excellent precedent.

▲ defrost 2 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

Thank you, it's always interesting hearing a USofAian PoV on the stupid things the country has done.

▲ greedo 3 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

[flagged]

	▲	defrost 2 hours ago \| parent [-]
		Strong comment, good response save for the opening snipe which gives reason for some to flag. Still time to take that out: https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html `Be kind. Don't be snarky. Converse curiously; don't cross-examine. Edit out swipes.`

▲ the_af 2 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

> Vietnam - actually has great relations with the US and we won the peace.

They won the peace (and the war). You didn't win shit. You lost, badly. The wound in the American psyche by this defeat will never heal, to the point we have to witness claims such as yours.

> Afghanistan - We wanted to provide schooling for little girls and stuff like that and, well, the population didn't want it. So at some point you cut your losses.

So you lost. Mainly because you went on a military adventure, with unclear goals, with a population you didn't understand. Much like in Vietnam!

And here you are, in Iran.

I think the one lesson you did learn is to heavily control the media and the narrative. Body bags and mission failures are bad press. Lesson learned.

▲ ElProlactin 2 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

> Vietnam - actually has great relations with the US and we won the peace.

Ironically, I used to teach English in Vietnam and my wife is Vietnamese.

The US didn't win anything. What Americans call the "Vietnam War" was and is called the American War in Vietnam. The country was absolutely decimated and left with scars that are still healing today (see for instance Agent Orange). After the US fled the country, it continued to wage what amounted to an economic war against Vietnam, excluding it from the global economy. Into the 90s, Vietnam was one of the poorest countries in the world. My wife's parents had relatives who survived the war only to starve to death after the war.

Vietnam, largely because of its geography, is a very smart and pragmatic country. It's the only country in the world that has comprehensive strategic relationships with the US, China and Russia.

Relations between the US and Vietnam are good because Vietnam's "bamboo diplomacy" policy allows it to leverage its unique position to extract benefit from all of the superpowers. Relations are not good because of US exceptionalism.

> The US usually starts the war because the US is the only country in the world actually trying to do anything about nefarious actors.

The good old, "I had to beat my wife because she wasn't acting right!"

> Iraq - well they had Saddam and now they have a functioning parliament and things seem to be going a lot better for them.

An estimated 300,000 to 1 million Iraqis died as a result of the war. But yeah, they have a parliament and "things seem to be going a lot better for them."

> Afghanistan - We wanted to provide schooling for little girls and stuff like that and, well, the population didn't want it. So at some point you cut your losses.

Do you actually believe anything you write? The US went into Afghanistan to get bin Laden and attempt to eliminate Afghanistan's role as a safe haven for Al Qaeda. Ironically, through Operation Cyclone, the US directly supported militant Islamic groups during the Soviet war, and where do you think the Taliban came from?

> Iran - We're not going to like invade and occupy Iran, though we could. We're just going to have to keep blowing up their military capabilities until they have a more reasonable government.

Iran has about 4 times the land area and double the population of Iraq. Given the amount of debt the US has and Trump's ecstatic destruction of Pax Americana by defecating on all of America's most important alliances, I think the most optimistic scenario is that the cost of making the Persian Empire again would be the collapse the American Empire.

▲ greedo 3 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

Good lessons. Like ignoring previous military plans that showed how tough a nut Iran would be to crack.

Lessons like the value of AWACs. Now we're down to 15 and the availability rate is like 50%. So 8 or so WORLDWIDE. Yeah, that's a good lesson. And we've cancelled its replacement after someone (probably Elon) whispered BS into Trump's ear about space based sensors.

I'm sure China is watching with a notepad out about all these lessons. Thucydides is rolling in his grave.

▲ ajsnigrutin 4 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

US is providing targeting information, weapons and money for ukraine... it seems totally fair that russia is providing the same info for iranians, hopefully they (and china) will send them some weapons too.

> instead of this authoritarian rah rah death to America and death to Israel nonsense.

After US and israel bombing them.... again... what do you think, will there be more or less "death to US" chants? Also, considering the number of dead people in iran, lebanon, palestine and other countries, the next step is probably special force work in US... the ones you guys call "terrorists".

▲ benjiro3000 2 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

[dead]

▲ bijowo1676 5 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

[flagged]

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riffraff 5 hours ago | parent | next [-]

Did you completely miss the disaster of DOGE in the first year of this administration?

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Goronmon 4 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

US welfare system seems to contain a lot of fraud, waste, abuse and grift across the board, so this will be a good chance to cleanse the system of fraud.

Taking money from social programs and piling into the military which contains "a lot of fraud, waste, abuse and grift across the board", certainly is a choice. Sort of the opposite of a smart choice, but definitely a choice for sure.

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bijowo1676 4 hours ago | parent [-]

[flagged]

	▲	FpUser 4 hours ago \| parent [-]
		>" taking money from fraud waste and abuse" Congrats. Finally somebody who wants to dismantle US government.

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AnimalMuppet 4 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

Uh huh. Do you have any confidence that this administration will do a competent job of that inspection? I don't. I mean, they could surprise me...