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palata 4 hours ago

I have always been pretty critical about "psychology" as a field, but always kept famous successful experiments (like Milgram and the Stanford prison experiment) as examples that "sometimes it's possible to actually get interesting results".

Turns out those are not valid examples either. So I am genuinely wondering: what remains of the field of psychology, except for a group of people who find it interesting to think about how other people think/behave? Are there examples of actual, useful and valid conclusions coming from that field?

Sharlin 4 hours ago | parent | next [-]

I'd think the conclusion you should draw is not that "even the famous experiments were not valid, so nothing in psychology is" but rather "the validity of an experiment does not correlate with how famous it is".

d-us-vb 3 hours ago | parent [-]

A direct conclusion. The insight I'll draw from that is that academia gives voice to the results the current zeitgeist finds interesting and believable without properly verifying the evidence.

See also the replication crisis.

wredcoll 31 minutes ago | parent | next [-]

I don't think academia runs fox news and cnn but I'll withhold judgement

watwut 2 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

Famous experiments are not chosen by academia. They are chosen by non academics. What you usually find is academics being much more reserved and more critical of these then journalists, bloggers or random commenters on HN.

embedding-shape 4 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

> Are there examples of actual, useful and valid conclusions coming from that field?

In order for someone to answer this, I think you need to come up with some sort of definition what "actual", "useful" and "valid" actually means here in this context.

Lots of stuff from psychology been successfully applied to treat people in therapy with various issues, but is that "valid" enough for you? Something tells me you already know some people are being helped in therapy one way or another, yet it seems to me those might not be "useful" enough, since I don't clearly understand what would be "useful" to you if not those examples.

bluGill 4 hours ago | parent [-]

Psychology "knows" that people don't enter treatment until things are really bad, and then they get better - no matter what treatment is provided. Finding treatment that is better than others is the important part and they also know they are not very good at that.

embedding-shape 4 hours ago | parent | next [-]

> and then they get better - no matter what treatment is provided

I don't know what experience of therapy you've had in the past, but this is typically not how it works. People get better when a treatment is applied that is suitable to them as a person and the context, not sure where you'd get the whole "people get better no matter what treatment is applied", haven't been true in my experience.

fgd135 2 hours ago | parent | next [-]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dodo_bird_verdict

bluGill 3 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

I'm only reporting what I heard in my intro to psychology class years ago... Still, this is more revision to a mean applying. There are for sure treatments that are better than doing nothing, there are also treatments worse than doing nothing. But in general people tend to get better after a time. (they often get worse again in a few months, but this was not covered in class).

3 hours ago | parent [-]
[deleted]
4 hours ago | parent | prev [-]
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IanCal 4 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

The results absolutely are interesting - in fact they’re far stronger for the willingness of many to inflict violence than the original description suggested.

> While every obedient participant reliably pressed the shock lever, they regularly neglected or ruined the other steps required to justify the shock.

Procedural violations here include things like asking the question while the person in the other room was still screaming.

eadler 4 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

You may enjoy https://forrt.org/ and in particular https://forrt.org/replication-hub/

jagged-chisel 4 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

The Hawthorne effect is real. And I don’t think we will ever get a 100% solid grip on what’s happening in others’ minds. Well, until we can actually read, understand, and interpret brain activity at the cellular level.

whynotmaybe 4 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

In Dan Ariely's book, "predictably irrational", there's a chapter about how everyone cheats a little.

And based on everyone I've met, and on Dan Ariely's own actions (1), I've concluded this one is true.

We all cheat a little from time to time.

Ex : for me, driving a few km/h above the speed limit is "cheating a little"

1 : https://www.businessinsider.com/dan-ariely-duke-fraud-invest...

caseyohara 3 hours ago | parent [-]

The ironic part is the recent fabrication controversy with Ariely. He’s recently had to retract fraudulent papers (one of them, most ironically, on the topic of honesty) because of falsified data. It makes one question the validity of all of his work.

His relationship with Jeffrey Epstein isn’t a good look either.

whynotmaybe 2 hours ago | parent [-]

"Irony regards every simple truth as a challenge."

Mason Cooley

tokai 4 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

Those two experiments are over 50 years old. Its a bit like dismissing physics because Hubble got his constant wrong. Psychology has a lot of issues, but its also an enormous field. If your frame of reference is half a century out of date you should probably start with some encyclopedia articles.