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alsetmusic 2 days ago

When one party will violate every norm and law to the greatest extent that they can get away with it, it's pretty much impossible to compete with them. I want good things for people. I can't compete with fascists because they will cheat and lie and employ violence. My positive intent is almost impossible to out thwart their dirty deeds if they are willing to break laws / change laws and I won't.

raw_anon_1111 2 days ago | parent | next [-]

It amazes me that so many people blame the politicians and not the people who elected them.

naikrovek 2 days ago | parent | next [-]

Well we can’t recall the voters, so there is no point in addressing them. They are a problem because in the US there used to be an FCC rule that said “if you call yourself a news program, you must tell the truth,” and that was overridden by the Supreme Court during Reagan’s term.

raw_anon_1111 2 days ago | parent [-]

No there was never a rule about “telling the truth” the rule was “equal time”. So if one party said “vaccines keep people from dying” and the other party said “vaccines would cause you to grow extra limbs” you had to allow them both on.

Second, it had nothing to do with the Supreme Court. The theory was that the airwaves belong to the public and the FCC has jurisdiction. It never applied to cable channels like FoxNews

Third, the current FCC is going after broadcast networks for not being fair under the rule

1718627440 2 days ago | parent [-]

> The theory was that the airwaves belong to the public and the FCC has jurisdiction.

Now most things go over the shared network (InterNet) so that problem should have fixed it self, no?

raw_anon_1111 2 days ago | parent [-]

Airwaves are limited resource - especially spectrum suitable for broadcast. Two companies can’t share the same broadcast spectrum.

The Internet is not a limited resource and not owned by the public and licensed to broadcasters. More than one company can lay cable.

Do you really want the government policing what can be said on the internet?

fragmede 2 days ago | parent [-]

It does already. Section 230 in the US isn't an unlimited get out of jail free card. Other countries have varying amount of policing, with differing levels of success and corruption. Spain, the UK, and China all come to mind here.

raw_anon_1111 2 days ago | parent [-]

Section 230 only has to do with defamation in this context not “misinformation”.

frantathefranta 2 days ago | parent | prev [-]

Blaming voters for being stupid is not widely accepted yet.

raw_anon_1111 2 days ago | parent [-]

The voters aren’t stupid. They are actively malignant and cheer what the administration is doing.

mrguyorama 2 days ago | parent [-]

Okay but what solution lies down that road?

That's the problem. People don't want to blame the voters because there's no solution. We are grasping for something that is possible to fix that isn't just "Somehow americans are especially bad at doing very basic things for no reason"

raw_anon_1111 2 days ago | parent | next [-]

Well, I personally am making the “Ben Kenobi” choice. I’m hoping to leave the US and retire and die and make it the next generation’s problem.

I’ve done my part, I have voted for “progressive”/safety net policies and the US has gone in the opposite direction. This isn’t some shrill unthought out plan.

I’m actually in the country now I plan to retire to for six weeks and I’m coming back for a month in the summer, part of the ex-pat community and meeting people, my wife and I have been learning Spanish and I speak it okay and I know the processes for establishing residency here

I’m over dealing with the American people. As a minority, I find the entire attitude outside of the US refreshing even as the only Black couple in our expat group. For reference, my still living parents grew up in the segregated South.

1718627440 2 days ago | parent | prev [-]

The large citizenries that later (19th century) forced administrations into constitutions and participation in policy started out with state mandated education and a class consciousness that is based on being knowledged and sophisticated. You need to make the next generation as smart as possible as you can, optimally also on topics concerning the society and economics.

raw_anon_1111 2 days ago | parent [-]

The late 19th century was also when “Separate but Equal” was enshrined as the law of the land by the Supreme Court and a few decades later there were Japanese internment camps…

throwaway85825 2 days ago | parent | prev | next [-]

There's only one party and it's color is green. Donors know red or blue doesn't matter, so they give to both.

gcanyon 2 days ago | parent | next [-]

That's just an unreal characterization that plays into the hands of the "red" team. One side has put up presidents and congressional leadership that worked (mostly, I'm not saying they're perfect) within the traditional framework of the system. The other has put up a president who literally does not understand the meaning of the word "no," expects that everyone will let him do pretty much anything he wants, and a congress that agrees with him. Notably, that side was different in 2000, 1988, 1980, etc. -- not perfect by any stretch, but not this.

The difference matters.

hypeatei 2 days ago | parent | prev [-]

Do you want another authoritarian, corrupt, cult of personality leader like Trump? Proclaiming "both sides" and ignoring nuance like you're doing is how no one gets held accountable for the real harms that are taking place. Please stop holding water for the MAGAs/GOP.

throwaway85825 2 days ago | parent [-]

America has had even more corrupt/authoritarian/cult of personality leaders than Trump. They were younger and their brains still worked so they did way more damage than trump too. Most Americans just don't learn much history so can't compare.

hypeatei 2 days ago | parent [-]

> America has had even more corrupt/authoritarian/cult of personality leaders than Trump.

Like who?

guzfip 2 days ago | parent [-]

Andrew Jackson to this day is a darling among conservatives in America.

2 days ago | parent | prev | next [-]
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southerntofu 2 days ago | parent | prev [-]

Assuming you're from the USA, your two main parties are exactly like that. The appearances have changed, but Obama drone-assassinating random children on the other side of the world was not much better than what Trump is doing.

Not defending Trump, to be clear, just saying US imperialism and fascism has much deeper roots and that removing Trump is not going to fix any issues the rest of the world has with the USA.

alsetmusic 2 days ago | parent | next [-]

USA government is corrupt, true. Current admin is balls-out corrupt in ways that have a French legislator calling out that impeachment would have happened there. It's shockingly out in the open corrupt, and that's saying a lot because most of the people ripping us off want to be somewhat quiet about it and not draw attention.

southerntofu 2 days ago | parent [-]

I didn't hear about this french legislator, but that's funny given the level of rampant corruption in french government. Nothing new (see also Pasqua, Foccart, etc), but in the past decades the information was not widely available so it was at least possible to pretend not to know.

Much of the government including Macron himself are involved in corruption scandals. Others are involved in rape scandals. Others in fiscal fraud. But you're correct they're not as open about it as Trump is.

gcanyon 2 days ago | parent | prev | next [-]

Can you point to an objective assessment of Obama's drone policy?

southerntofu 2 days ago | parent | next [-]

Unfortunately, i don't know of a complete reference resource. I'd be interested if you found one. A quick research later i found this CFR resource [1] which probably underestimates the number of civilians killed.

I remember reports at the time on the Intercept and other media about the entire kill chain. If i remember correctly, the policy was to count anyone who was not proved to be a civilian as an active enemy in the body count. There was this DOD/CIA press conference announcing they made a targeted killing and that their target assessment was mostly based on the individual's height.

Then there's of course Obama famously and publicly joking about his children's lovers suggesting they should behave or would get killed by « predator drones ». [2] Let me know if you dig interesting links on the topic!

[1] https://www.cfr.org/articles/obamas-final-drone-strike-data

[2] https://abcnews.com/WN/president-obama-tells-joke-jonas-brot...

gcanyon a day ago | parent [-]

> famously and publicly joking ...at the white house correspondents dinner. I think that context matters.

I also think drone strikes exacerbate public outrage much the way mass shootings do: if we want to decrease gun deaths, limiting AR-15s isn't the way to do it because the vast majority of gun deaths are handguns. But mass shootings upset people, so we outlaw the guns that upset them. Similarly with drones, people don't get as upset about tens of thousands killed in a broader war, they're put off by the smaller number of casualties caused by drones.

You would think that if the policy was as flawed as you describe it would be easier to find evidence of it now?

2 days ago | parent | prev [-]
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actionfromafar 2 days ago | parent | prev [-]

It was not better, it was less. US imperialism has deep roots, yes, but a large chunk of the world who would tolerate a moderate level of it, don't tolerate this level.

nandomrumber 2 days ago | parent | next [-]

I don’t see any not tolerating it in practice.

A lot of invective, but nothing in practice that really indicates not tolerating.

actionfromafar 2 days ago | parent [-]

I hear rumblings about foreign companies disconnecting from American services and products. You don't turn large ships on a dime, but they are turning.

southerntofu 2 days ago | parent | prev [-]

I don't think it was less, though only future historians will come up with actual numbers. It was less public, though.

Most of the world never tolerated it. Even when western governments tolerated it, the population did not; see also the huge worldwide demonstrations against the Iraq war.

I think the difference in perception is because the european oligarchy is now being effectively treated as was previously the rest of the world, so they're now taking a stance because they feel threatened, whereas they previously saw themselves as aligned with the US government no matter what.