| ▲ | orange_joe 2 days ago |
| America clearly has an EV industry (Tesla, Rivian) but its adoption is pretty limited by infrastructure. |
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| ▲ | declan_roberts 2 days ago | parent | next [-] |
| I don't think this is true, at least for Tesla, which has a very mature and wide range of chargers almost everywhere. AFAIK, Rivian can also use Tesla chargers now. |
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| ▲ | ectospheno 2 days ago | parent | next [-] | | I live on the eastern coast of the US. I travel for work up and down the eastern seaboard. Sometimes I ride with a coworker who drives his Tesla. The experience turned me off of ever buying one. Yes, chargers are everywhere here. But making multiple “stops” to charge that you wouldn’t otherwise make definitely isn’t saving any time. The seats are horrid. Watching the windshield wipers freak out over nothing is funny. “Full self driving” is a bit of a joke. | | |
| ▲ | BoneShard a day ago | parent [-] | | We can despise Musk as much as we want, but I leased a Tesla Model 3 for three years and it was the best car I've ever owned. I had zero issues, it was always charged, zero maintenance(other than topping off washer fluid), and for long trips, I usually rent a car anyway. I seriously considered buying a Model S once my lease ended, but thanks to Musk’s shenanigans, I’m waiting for a Rivian R2 or R3 instead. And yes Teslas aren't for passengers but for drivers. |
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| ▲ | kube-system 2 days ago | parent | prev [-] | | It is mature enough to barely support the current level of adoption which is between 1 and 2% of cars on the road. Also charging at home is a significant part of EV infrastructure which is also sorely lacking in the US | | |
| ▲ | triceratops a day ago | parent [-] | | US car garages don't have regular, 120v power outlets? | | |
| ▲ | kube-system a day ago | parent [-] | | Less than half of US occupied residences have a carport or garage that they own. Many single family homes lack a garage, particularly in the northeast US. And many in apartments lack access to power even if they have a garage. | | |
| ▲ | triceratops 13 hours ago | parent [-] | | Only 1-2% of US households have a garage with a 120v outlet? | | |
| ▲ | kube-system 12 hours ago | parent [-] | | I said just slightly less than half. It’s about 49% Above, I said the current level of the adoption of EVs in the US is 1% to 2%. That’s how many vehicles on the road today are EVs. As I’m sure you know there’s multiple places to charge electric vehicles. You can charge them at home but when you’re on a long trip, you have to charge them somewhere else. We need more infrastructure investment, both in public charging and in residential charging. The public charging infrastructure that exist today supports that 1 to 2% of vehicles that are currently EVs. |
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| ▲ | ericmay 2 days ago | parent | prev | next [-] |
| And Lucid. I’m not sure it’s the infrastructure so much as the cost for these vehicles. Well, Tesla has political problems but Rivian and Lucid don’t - but they are priced quite high. |
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| ▲ | maxerickson 2 days ago | parent [-] | | It's kind of a yes both. A base Model 3 is in the same price range as decent hybrids that will be more convenient for many owners given current highway adjacent charging infrastructure. Of course there are also new vehicles that cost quite a bit less than a base Model 3, but they invite a discussion of not being all that comparable. | | |
| ▲ | ericmay 2 days ago | parent [-] | | My post was poorly worded I meant to say Tesla wasn’t too high of a price but it has political problems (we won’t buy another one for example). Lucid and Rivian don’t have those problems but they are quite expensive relatively speaking. | | |
| ▲ | maxerickson 2 days ago | parent [-] | | But Tesla is priced high for anyone that is even moderately price sensitive. Even the base model of their cheapest car. | | |
| ▲ | ericmay 2 days ago | parent [-] | | Sure if $37k is a lot for a car I’ll agree with you. Then I think Tesla is now just joining Rivian and Lucid by being too expensive. The infrastructure would be besides the point then because you don’t care about that if you can’t even afford the car. | | |
| ▲ | hypeatei 2 days ago | parent [-] | | > Sure if $37k is a lot for a car 37k with 20% down payment means you borrow $29k at say, a 4.79% interest rate for 60 months so... $556/month. I know we're on HN with high salaried tech workers but c'mon, that's a lot of money and doesn't even include insurance. That and their base model 3 is RWD which makes it a non-starter for anyone who drives in snow/ice. The AWD model starts at $47k. | | |
| ▲ | ericmay 2 days ago | parent | next [-] | | A Honda CRV Hybrid for example starts at $35k (Accord Hybrid is 34k) and that's a pretty common vehicle here in Ohio. We could debate the capabilities and such and what you get for your money, but I'm just not in an agreement that $37k is a lot of money for a car. I've owned a base model 3 RWD and live in Ohio where we regularly get all of the weather, sometimes the same day even. I would rather drive that than an AWD Honda or Toyota or similar. The weight and center of gravity, especially with the right tires, makes it a very nice vehicle to drive in adverse conditions. Those "average" market SUVs aren't very good in snow/ice either. At least in my experience. | | |
| ▲ | maxerickson 2 days ago | parent [-] | | Well, speaking as someone who is moderately price sensitive, I'm probably going to shop for a used car. I'm not sure people are reading my comments above as making 2 comparisons. I used "decent hybrids" as a group of cars that are roughly comparable to the Model 3, but more convenient in areas where chargers are sparse (in northern Michigan and the Upper Peninsula, you pretty much have to plan your route to the available chargers). And then I noted that there are cars that are available for quite a lot less, so anyone that is price sensitive probably isn't going to be shopping for a new electric vehicle that costs nearly $40k. | | |
| ▲ | ericmay a day ago | parent [-] | | Yea I think we got side-tracked here in discussing what is affordable. But my point was that the big 3 EV makers in the United States: Tesla, Lucid, Rivian are either politically uncompetitive (Tesla) or financially uncompetitive (all three if you are also arguing Tesla is too expensive) and because of that the charging infrastructure isn't relevant if you are already thinking the car itself costs too much. As an aside I've been to the UP and it's lovely up there. At the time (2020) there weren't really any charging stations except Maciniac City where there was a Tesla Supercharger and Marquette where, my wife and I found ourselves for about 12 hours charging our car in a parking garage. But Tesla has built a few new Superchargers in the area and they are to varying degrees open to other EV manufacturers. |
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| ▲ | senordevnyc 2 days ago | parent | prev [-] | | The average new car transaction price in the US is about $50k. |
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| ▲ | yardie 2 days ago | parent | prev | next [-] |
| It's not even the infrastructure. It's generally a lot of FUD. Everyone fears they have to buy a 800-mile range SUV for the frequent roadtrips they take apparently. I commute 1000 miles every month. That is 4x DCFC every month vs 2.5 petrol fillups for the same period. I also know a lot of drivers who plan to get an EV when their current car stops working. A lot of people are feeling economically anxious right now. They know gas is a dead end so they are squeezing every last mile out of the cars they currently own. Car companies can't exist on the wishes of their customers. Everyone is doing a lot of hoping that its the right time. The EV rebates were a great tool in getting to that tipping point but they were cancelled too son in my estimation. |
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| ▲ | 2 days ago | parent | prev | next [-] |
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| ▲ | cyanydeez 2 days ago | parent | prev [-] |
| AlSo by goverment lobby, tHe mosT equal branch of modern USA |
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