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pm90 3 days ago

anecdotally every place ive worked at has switched over and never looked back.

_moof 3 days ago | parent | next [-]

Same. It's game-changing - leaps and bounds above every previous attempt to make Python's packaging, dependency management, and dev workflow easy. I don't know anyone who has tried uv and not immediately thrown every other tool out the window.

macNchz 3 days ago | parent [-]

I use uv here and there but have a bunch of projects using regular pip with pip-tools to do a requirements.in -> requirements.txt as a lockfile workflow that I've never seen enough value in converting over. uv is clearly much faster but that's a pretty minor consideration unless I were for some reason changing project dependencies all day long.

Perhaps it never grabbed me as much because I've been running basically everything in Docker for years now, which takes care of Python versioning issues and caches the dependency install steps, so they only take a long time if they've changed. I also like containers for all of the other project setup and environment scaffolding stuff they roll up, e.g. having a consistently working GDAL environment available instantly for a project I haven't worked on in a long time.

imp0cat 3 days ago | parent [-]

2 things: First, you can (and should) replace your `pip install` with `uv pip install` for instant speed boost. This matters even for Docker builds.

Second, you can use uv to build and install to a separate venv in a Docker container and then, thanks to the wonders of multistage Docker builds, copy that venv to a new container and have a fully working minimal image in no time, with almost no effort.

shawnwall 3 days ago | parent | prev [-]

been in the python game a long time and i've seen so many tools in this space come and go over the years. i still rely on good ol pip and have had no issues. that said, we utilize mypy and ruff, and have moved to pyproject etc to remotely keep up with the times.

jitl 3 days ago | parent | next [-]

uv solved it, it will be the only tool people use in 2 more years. if you’re a python shop / expert then you can do pip etc but uv turned incidental python + deps from a huge PITA for the rest of us, to It Just Works simplicity on the same level or better than Golang.

pdntspa 3 days ago | parent | next [-]

Then can they please figure out some way of invoking it that doesnt require prefixing everything with 'uv'

maleldil 3 days ago | parent | next [-]

You can source the virtualenv like normal.

ghshephard a day ago | parent | prev | next [-]

Solved with direnv. Also - in my .bashrc in all of my (many) clients:

  $ type uvi uvl uvv
  uvi is a function
  uvi ()
  {
      uv pip install $@
  }
  uvl is a function
  uvl ()
  {
      uv pip list
  }
  uvv is a function
  uvv ()
  {
      uv venv;
      cat > .envrc <<EOF
  source .venv/bin/activate
  EOF

      direnv allow
  }
arw0n 3 days ago | parent | prev | next [-]

For any command, you can create an 'alias' in your shell config. That way you can get rid of the prefix.

duskdozer 20 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

That would defeat the purpose of creating and expanding their brand.

cjp 3 days ago | parent | prev | next [-]

direnv, .envrc, "layout uv"

https://github.com/direnv/direnv/wiki/Python#uv

tomrod 3 days ago | parent | prev | next [-]

alias in ~/.zshrc?

malcolmgreaves 3 days ago | parent | prev [-]

uv run bash/zsh/your shell of choice

1718627440 3 days ago | parent | prev [-]

I don't want software on my computer, that just downloads and installs random stuff. This is the job of the OS in particular the package manager.

jitl 3 days ago | parent | next [-]

You're welcome to live in the 90s dark ages, I feel this attitude and the shape of the old linux distros like Debian that laboriously re-package years-old software have been one of the biggest failures of open source and squandered untold hours of human effort. It's a model that works okay for generic infrastructure but requires far too much labor and moves far too slowly with quite a poor experience for end users and developers. Why else would all modern software development (going back to perl's cpan package manager in 1995) route around it?

zbentley 3 days ago | parent | prev | next [-]

Do you not use non-OS package managers?

If not, do you develop software with source dependencies (go, java, node, rust, python)? If so, how do you handle acquiring those dependencies—by hand or using a tool?

1718627440 3 days ago | parent | next [-]

> Do you not use non-OS package managers?

Mostly no, sometimes I give up and still use pip as a separate user.

> If not, do you develop software with source dependencies (go, java, node, rust, python)? If so, how do you handle acquiring those dependencies—by hand or using a tool

I haven't felt the need to use Go, the only Java software I use is in the OS repo. I don't want to use JS software for other reasons. This is one of the reasons why I don't like Rust rewrites. Python dependencies are very often in the OS repo. If there is anything else, I compile it from source and I curse when software doesn't use or adheres to the standard of the GNU build system.

maleldil 3 days ago | parent | next [-]

I hope you understand you are part of a very, very small minority.

zbentley 2 days ago | parent | prev [-]

Thanks for explaining your workflow. It seems predictable, but like it really locks you into one of the few (albeit popular) programming languages that has many/most of its development libraries repackaged by your OS. There are plenty of very popular languages that don't offer that at all.

Go and Rust, specifically, seem a bit odd to be allergic to. Their "package managers" are largely downloading sources into your code repository, not downloading/installing truly arbitrary stuff. How is that different from your (presumably "wget the file into my repo or include path") workflow for depending on a header-only C library from the internet which your OS doesn't repackage?

I understand if your resistance to those platforms is because of how much source code things download, but that still seems qualitatively different to me from "npm install can do god-knows-what to my workstation" or "pip install can install packages that shadow system-wide trusted ones".

LtWorf 3 days ago | parent | prev [-]

Personally I run "apt install whateverineed"

ghshephard a day ago | parent | prev | next [-]

I very much appreciate the sentiment - and agree that random crap (particularly some of the insane dependency chains that you get from NPM, but also Rust) in which you go to install a simple (at least you believe) package - and the Rust/NPM manager downloads several hundred dependencies.

But the problem with only using the OS package manager is that you then lock yourself out of the entire ecosystem of node, python, rust packages that have never been migrated to whatever operating system you are using - which might be very significant.

How do you feel about Nix? It feels like this is a nice half-way measure between reliable/reproducible builds, but without all of the Free For all where you are downloading who-knows-what-from-where onto your OS?

dotancohen 3 days ago | parent | prev | next [-]

In general I agree with you. But not for software dev packages.

The package manager I use, apt on Debian, does not package many Python development repos. They've got the big ones, e.g. requests, but not e.g. uuid6. And I wouldn't want it to - I like the limited Debian dev effort to be put towards the user experience and let the Python dev devs worry about packaging Python dev dependencies.

QuantumNomad_ 3 days ago | parent | prev | next [-]

What’s the point of constraining oneself to what is in the OS package manager? I like to keep my dependencies up to date. The versions in the OS package manager are much older.

And let’s say you constrain yourself to your OS package manager. What about the people on different distros? Their package managers are unlikely to have the exact same versions of your deps that your OS has.

1718627440 3 days ago | parent [-]

> What’s the point of constraining oneself to what is in the OS package manager? I like to keep my dependencies up to date. The versions in the OS package manager are much older.

I favor stability and the stripping of unwanted features (e.g. telemetry) by my OS vendor over cutting edge software. If I really need that I install it into /usr/local, that it what this is for after all.

> And let’s say you constrain yourself to your OS package manager. What about the people on different distros? Their package managers are unlikely to have the exact same versions of your deps that your OS has.

This is a reason to select the OS. Software shouldn't require exact versions, but should stick to stable interfaces.

wiseowise 3 days ago | parent | prev | next [-]

Don't worry, gramps, pip won't trigger your tinfoil hat.

mirekrusin 3 days ago | parent | prev | next [-]

Then don't use it?

maccard 3 days ago | parent | prev | next [-]

Do you use pip?

nimchimpsky 2 days ago | parent | prev [-]

[dead]

tomrod 3 days ago | parent | prev [-]

Geospatial tends to be the Achilles heel for python projects for me. Fiona is a wiley beast of a package, and GDAL too. Conda helped some but was always so slow. Pip almost uniformly fails in this area for me.

crimsoneer 3 days ago | parent [-]

Yup, the fact UV just installed geopandas out of the box with no issues blew my mind.