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throw0101c 10 hours ago

> And it’s not just execs, but the whole corporate machinery that takes 3–6 weeks after quarter end to churn out reports.

Release early, release often.

If you want corporate machinery to run more smoothly with less effort, force it to operate more frequently not less: when TLS certs had 2-3 year lifespans there was all sorts of manual methods that people forgot how to do; then it was maximum one year. We then got free certs from LE (using ACME), but they were 90 days, so that made automation much more necessary.

Now with certs from public CAs having a max time of 47 days soon (not that I'm necessarily a fan) automation is all but a must.

So if you want less onerous effort on corporate reporting, your workflows and processes need to be much more automated: that's one of the reason why computers were invented after-all, to make computations faster.

And one way to force automation is to insist on more frequent reporting, not less; Barry Ritholtz:

> This is exactly backward: More frequent reporting makes the data less significant. In the real world, human behavior emphasizes what occurs less often—meaning doing something less frequently gives it an even greater significance than something that becomes routine or common.

> That is the difference between a New Year’s Eve celebration and a married couple’s weekly date night.

> Twice-a-year earnings reporting will make the event so momentous, with such focus on it, that any company that misses analysts’ forecasts will find their stock price shellacked. The twice-yearly focus on making the per-share number will become overwhelmingly intense.

* https://www.fa-mag.com/news/reporting-profits-daily-would-en...

Move from quarter / every-3-months to monthly reporting: companies will be forced to automate their "corporate machinery". And each report will be much less 'momentous' because the time between samples will be much less.

fnordpiglet 9 hours ago | parent | next [-]

I up you to continuous reporting. Audit should be inherent to the system, not a process after the fact. As a public company all owners should have access to daily closed books, and all companies should be able to close their books daily in 2026.

Every six months being the cadence we learn how our companies we own are doing is absurd. It leads to really long dark periods. Also for employees it means we can only divest in a semi annual window. Our carry risk is extensive and expanding.

This is about hiding truth longer, which is the MO of this administration top to bottom.

jandrewrogers 8 hours ago | parent | next [-]

That is an absurd cadence. It is extremely expensive to do this reporting; an an enormous amount of useless activity is slaved to providing it in companies that need to. This is literally a call for more bureaucracy theater.

The obvious net effect is that companies would structure themselves to no longer have the reporting requirement, as the cost of reporting exceeds the benefits. That would not benefit society at large.

mixdup 8 hours ago | parent | next [-]

The reason quarters take so long to close is because the numbers are being fiddled with. There's no reason someone shouldn't be able to close a quarter and report the numbers with the automation we have today in technology, meaning without some magic AI/LLM, other than people are constantly trying to reclassify expenses or income in a way that saves the quarter

Why, after 30-40 years of modern computing in accounting does it still take a month to close the books? I worked at a public company that was $100m revenue yearly and it took a whole month to close the books. Absolute insanity. Even AT&T or Verizon or GM should be able to report at least weekly.

jandrewrogers 8 hours ago | parent | next [-]

This is a naive view of what reporting entails and the difficulty of coalescing a report that meets the requirements of the audience the report is for. It isn't a numbers dump from a database, it requires substantial interpretation of things that the database does not and cannot contain. It isn't fiddling with the numbers, it is that the numbers can't contain things relevant to their representation for external parties as a legal matter.

When I have been in positions where reporting was a necessary part of my job, reporting related activity probably consumed 1/3 of my time. Even in highly optimized contexts, it consumes a stupid amount of time and the impact on the consumers of those reports is often quite low. It is almost a total waste of time.

There should be some reporting but the current cadence and requirements is way too high for many large companies. Reporting doesn't have infinite ROI.

davorak 5 hours ago | parent | next [-]

> it requires substantial interpretation of things that the database does not and cannot contain.

Do you have examples? This seems like something that is a solvable problem, and from the outside it can seem like it is only about not being willing to switch to a new paradigm. That unwilling ness can come from avoiding real consequences like loosing a competitive edge due to allocation of resources to the switchover.

CSMastermind 4 hours ago | parent [-]

When people think of automation I'm assuming their thinking of the financial statements (balance sheet, income, cash flows, equity).

Reporting also contains narrative explanations by management of: the company's financial health, updates on any new or existing market risks and the company's strategy to deal with them, any changes to controls or accounting procedures, updates on any new or existing litigation, and more.

These reports need to be certified for truth by the CEO, CFO, and relevant officers under penalty of 10+ years in jail and millions of dollars in fines personally.

It's also common to do a press release, earnings call, and investor presentation but those aren't required.

Dylan16807 6 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

Why can't that interpretation be done earlier in the process and then put into the database?

Isn't it the same amount of transactions to be interpreted no matter what the reporting period is?

jandrewrogers 6 hours ago | parent [-]

Do you understand that as a legal matter these must be good faith representations of the current state to the best of your knowledge? You can’t serve up intentionally stale information without inviting legal repercussions. The preparation process takes weeks. This is a very serious legal matter.

These are being revised and updated right up until the point they are released to provide the most accurate reporting possible.

You gravely underestimate the legal seriousness of these reports.

davorak 5 hours ago | parent | next [-]

> You can’t serve up intentionally stale information without inviting legal repercussions.

> These are being revised and updated right up until the point they are released to provide the most accurate reporting possible.

> You gravely underestimate the legal seriousness of these reports.

All of these seem look like an argument for additional automation.

Dylan16807 6 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

The category changes over time?

So let's try to think of solutions instead of giving up. A law that requires daily disclosure can change how the reporting works so you don't need to update those category decisions 200 times.

FireBeyond 7 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

My fiancee is the accounting manager at a university. Why? Because people don't submit expenses on time, invoices are delayed or some still done manually, and all manner of things. Even for them it can take a couple of weeks.

While there may be some "hijinks" (in their case, institutional advancement likes to steadily rearrange endowments or donations to take advantage of offers to match donations, etc., but that's not really a delay, as accounting basically says things like "No, that gift has already been spent"). Even with things like Concur or Expensify, expenses aren't classified on time, submitted for reimbursement, etc.

gzread 6 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

That was the point - it's absurd as a manual process, and forces automation.

joquarky 6 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

> an an enormous amount of useless activity is slaved to providing it in companies that need to

Curious why the word "slaved" was used here instead of the much more nominal "employed".

strogonoff 4 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

[dead]

testrun 6 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

You don't have all the relevant invoices etc at on time. Some of that takes quite awhile. Especially inter country purchases and sale transaction information.

sheepscreek 9 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

This sounds great on paper till you realize the amount of time and effort that goes into coordinating so many humans is significant. Also quarterly reporting and TLS certs are worlds apart. There are things like SOX compliance in public companies. It is a mandatory requirement that necessitates so much ceremony surrounding how information is captured and decisions signed off. Then for the execs themselves, it is at least a week of effort easy leading up to the quarterly result call. Prepping for the investor deck, QnAs, being open to more frequent regulator scrutiny. Doing this every month would have diminishing returns for everyone involved.

Source: worked at public companies, helped executives prepare for said calls.

etempleton 8 hours ago | parent | next [-]

I think it shifts the skillset of executives a little bit. At publicly traded companies the quarterly shareholder meetings and the preparation that goes into it becomes such an outsized portion of the job that being good at that one thing is highly valued. I don’t think moving quarterly to bi-annually changes that much besides making the CEO and CFOs and some other folks jobs a bit easier.

8 hours ago | parent | prev [-]
[deleted]
nickff 10 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

The problem with reporting often is that the reports must each be audited (which is time-intensive and expensive), and any errors subject the companies to class-action lawsuits (which only ever benefit the lawyers, but that is a separate matter).

I would also prefer more frequent reports, but only if they were less burdensome and risky.

hatsix 10 hours ago | parent | next [-]

The reports don't have to each be audited... reduce the auditing to twice a year, increase reporting to monthly... if your report requires remediation, you her bumped to quarterly audits

nickff 9 hours ago | parent [-]

The company would probably be sued if there were any issues in one of the monthly reports; the money for the plaintiff lawyers is just too appealing. I think monthly 'informal' reports with some legal protections to allow for inaccuracies and inconsistencies, with biennial 'formal' reports would be wonderful. That said, I think allowing companies to select an appropriate reporting interval might be best.

runarberg 9 hours ago | parent [-]

Feels like a first world problem. If your company cannot afford to output accurate reports every month, maybe it shouldn’t be a company at all.

gzread 6 hours ago | parent | next [-]

Shouldn't be a public company, at least. You can squander your own money as you like.

nickff 9 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

Do you have any sources to back up your feelings? I’m basing my comments on what I’ve read about the matter from a variety of former public company CEOs, CFOs, and COOs.

runarberg 8 hours ago | parent [-]

I am coming to this from a perspective of a worker who used to get quarterly options of the public company I worked for, and I just cannot for the life of me sympathize with a company complaining that it can only afford to gather the information to calculate the worth of the stocks they are paying me in two times a year. I don‘t care how much it costs them. If you are gonna be paying and trading in stocks, I expect you to do the work required.

chermi 8 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

Ahhh yes. As we all know regulations and requirements and bureaucracy never have unintended consequences, especially on the little guy. All that matters is intent, right?

Uvix 7 hours ago | parent [-]

The "little guy" isn't a publicly listed company issuing reports. By the time you have an IPO, you're no longer little.

runako 10 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

Longer periods between audited (aka "accurate") results will lead to compounding errors. Fewer people at the company will have a clear idea of how the company is doing. Audits are like CI for finances.

nickff 10 hours ago | parent [-]

I agree that would be preferable if reporting were less expensive and (legally) risky, and what you're describing is definitely closer to the original intent of the rule (that of giving investors the information available to management), but it would make being a public company even more burdensome than it already is, and the number of public corporations is already in decline.

runako 10 hours ago | parent | next [-]

> it would make being a public company even more burdensome than it already is

Every company doesn't have to be public. The US taxpayer underwrites US securities markets, and companies that trade on our public markets have access to some of the deepest pools of low-cost liquidity in the world. But companies are obviously free to list elsewhere.

> the number of public corporations is already in decline.

Separate problem. IIRC HBS studied this and basically the issue is we stopped enforcing our anti-competition laws a while back[1]. So we end up with a fraction of firms that each sector would financially support. Both because it creates giants that are much harder to compete against, and because it allows mergers between competing firms that AFAIK could be deemed illegal under existing laws.

1 - See, for example the Robinson-Patman Act, whose dormancy allows big box retailers to exist. This law has never been repealed.

Karrot_Kream 9 hours ago | parent [-]

When companies stay private longer, private capital stays tied up for longer, decreasing public liquidity and keeping bad private investments afloat for longer. Part of the creative destruction of the dot com bust was the legion of badly performing companies that went public and were thoroughly rejected by public investors, offering an exit to later investors and employees. Right now badly performing companies can limp along tying up liquidity and locking up employee equity only to head to an eventual bankruptcy or bad IPO.

throw0101c 9 hours ago | parent | next [-]

> Part of the creative destruction of the dot com bust was the legion of badly performing companies that went public and were thoroughly rejected by public investors, offering an exit to later investors and employees.

That's not how I remember it. I remember lots of publicly traded company shares being gobbled even though their business plans[1] were essentially:

1. Collect underpants

2. ?

3. Profit

"Going for marketshare" and not making a profit was still popular as recently as Uber/DoorDash/etc. Cisco still (AIUI) hasn't reached back to is DotCom peak.

Are the current multiples of many tech stocks sensible?

[1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gnomes_(South_Park)

Karrot_Kream 9 hours ago | parent [-]

I'm having a hard time responding to someone who's using a South Park episode as a discussion point. Like how can I debate a point made by a show that makes content reacting to the popular perception of certain ideas? That's like 2 levels removed from the actual true details.

Anyway the difference now is that those companies still exist they just take round after round of private investor capital and the employees are offered shares that will never be tradable. Were those businesses would go bankrupt in a few years before now they can take 5-10 years. Time value of money being a thing, your money will be locked up for longer in a bad investment than it would on the public markets.

runako 8 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

> badly performing companies can limp along tying up liquidity and locking up employee equity

"Just raised a Series E/F/G/H/I" companies

HeWhoLurksLate 10 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

how much of that decline is due to mergers vs failing vs new private companies being formed instead?

balderdash 9 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

In the us, quarterly financials are not audited, only annual financials

throw0101c 10 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

Perhaps the auditing needs to be done on the workflow process and once the automated code is in place there needs to be a traceable chain of modifications to it that need to be justified.

The "audit" certifies a certain hash of a repo that produces known-good results, and if you use a different commit in that repo you have explain in an SEC filing why you modified things.

Basically reproducible builds for financial results:

* https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reproducible_builds

3eb7988a1663 10 hours ago | parent [-]

I know a few accountants, and I do not think this is possible. There is an incredible amount of manual adjustments that have to occur to get the books in order. I suspect the official process is 100% GAAP approved and great, but the messy reality has thousands of tweaks that were massaged all over the place to correct for one thing or another.

throw0101c 9 hours ago | parent | next [-]

Yes, I know some accountants as well, as well as bookkeepers who have to do adjustments for things like 'timecards' and punching-in and -out: there's all sorts of adjusting that needs to be made.

But any "mistakes" that are made are simply corrected the next reporting period (whether that's monthly, fortnightly, weekly, or daily) in this more-frequent proposal.

The 'crunches' that occur at quarter/period-end are there because there is so much attention put on those reports because they're so infrequent. If the sampling rate is higher then errors are corrected that much sooner.

The reports are generated on the books in the state that they currently are in on a monthly/fortnightly/weekly/daily basis, and any adjustments will be "fixed" in the next reporting period. The reason why there's so much pressure to get them "correct" now is because of the (relatively) infrequent reporting. If you know that things will be 'sorted out' in a fortnight (two weeks), or whatever, there's less pressure now to get them "right".

There will be an expectation of less perfecttion and more corrections and better 'smoothing' due to the higher 'sampling rate'.

sowbug 9 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

Isn't that the kind of toil that tends to get automated away with CI/CD?

DesaiAshu 9 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

You could report every month and audit every 6 months

irjustin 9 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

I'm generally with the report often camp. It forces automation all the way down even the auditing.

ezfe 9 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

Wouldn't the auditing be proportionally easier with less data in each report?

otterley 9 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

The reason for strong auditing and personal attestation is because left to their own devices, some companies will produce bullshit and hoodwink investors. Blame Enron.

https://www.britannica.com/topic/Sarbanes-Oxley-Act

Like the building and electrical code, these regulations were written in blood.

throw0101c 9 hours ago | parent [-]

> The reason for strong auditing and personal attestation is because left to their own devices, some companies will produce bullshit and hoodwink investors. Blame Enron.

Except Enron's results were audited. By (now defunct) Arthur Anderson:

* https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Enron_scandal

* https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Arthur_Andersen#Collapse

The auditing already existed and didn't stop Enron (or WorldCom; see also the silliness of GE under Jack Welch).

Sure SOx added more rules, but it's not like folks were flying without a net before.

clickety_clack 8 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

TLS certs are a single certificate. Corporate reporting is an aggregate of different types of numbers in disparate systems summed up through divisions that might as well be different companies.

Although… if there was a software engineering union, swinging a mandate for live public financial reporting is the type of non productive work that would keep everyone in a job.

jandrewrogers 8 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

Reporting is onerous as fuck. You end up with entire bureaucracies dedicated to the theater of reporting. The tighter the turnaround the dicier it becomes because certainty that anything you are reporting is true decreases, which increases liability.

This is one of those ideas that sounds amazing to people have never operated a real business with reporting requirements. In practice it turns into a classic case of Goodhart's Law. It drives insane incentives. Reducing reporting intervals would seriously reduce overheads and inefficiency in business.

This is 100% a good change.

JumpCrisscross 9 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

> Release early, release often

Release unrequired. This is the purpose of an 8-K. We don’t need every public firm to constantly release quarterly.

These rules arose in 1970. Granting more flexibility, now, makes sense. (Post SOX, earnings require senior management.)

jimmygrapes 10 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

https://www.acquisition.gov/gsam/552.216-75

I get where you're coming from but this is a rough transition for some. Ideally we would hope that more frequent reporting would necessitate development of more seamless systems... but we ain't there yet. There's a lot of flexibility in some systems but they allow that flexibility so that it can be tightened as needed. Be careful.

DANmode 9 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

…huh?

What does any of this have to do with too-soon reports poorly representing positive trends that can’t be tracked in 1-3 month timelines?