Plenty of historical examples of work environments where sabotage would have been the most ethical thing to do (and often you will only know in hindsight). But yeah in most circumstances a simple disagreement doesn’t warrant the psychological cost of such sabotage.

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jstummbillig 2 hours ago | parent [-]

What do you mean...? Plenty to do what?

Your opinion of the situation is not enough to justify this course of action in 99.99% of cases and the residual 0.01% should not be enough to fuel your ego to do anything other than quit decently, and look for an employer that is more aligned with whatever your ideals are.

I repeat the insane statement that we are arguing over here: "Ethically, if you do not agree with the company you work at, the optimal course of action if you can stomach it is to stay and do a bad job rather than get replaced by someone who might do a good job."

This says: ANY company you work for and disagree with over anything: Don't quit! Sabotage [maybe people are confused about what "do a bad job" means, and that this usually leads to other people getting hurt in some way, directly or indirectly, unless your job is entirely inconsequential]. And that's supposed to be ethically optimal.

What the fuck?

	▲	berdario an hour ago \| parent \| next [-]
		I think there's a bit of confusion between > (Ethically, if you do not agree with the company you work at), the optimal course of action is.. And > Ethically, (if you do not agree with the company you work at, the optimal course of action is...) The former, should've probably been phrased "if you do not agree ethically with the company you work at, the optimal course of action is..." First example that comes to mind, about a movie that portrays ethical sabotage is https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Schindler%27s_List I'm actually a bit unsure about what could be the motivations of someone who engages in sabotage not for ethical reasons
	▲	mcherm 19 minutes ago \| parent \| prev \| next [-]
		A specific example will help. Imagine I am working for a company and I discover they are engaged in capturing and transporting human slaves. Furthermore, the government where they operate in fully aware and supportive of their actions so denouncing them publicly is unlikely to help. This is a real situation that has happened to real people at points in history in my own country. I believe that one ethical response would be to violate my contract with the company by assisting slaves to escape and even providing them with passage to other places where slavery is illegal. Now, if you agree with the ethics of the example I gave then you agree in principle that this can be ethical behavior and what remains to be debated is whether xAI's criminal behavior and support from the government rise to this same level. I know many who think that badly aligned AI could lead to the extinction of the human race, so the potential harm is certainly there (at least some believe it is), and I think the government support is strong enough that denouncing xAI for unethical behavior wouldn't cause the government to stop them.
	▲	andrewingram an hour ago \| parent \| prev \| next [-]
		There's a _big_ continuum between disagreeing over something and an ethical hard line, it feels like a slippery slope to interpete a suggested approach for one end of that line as advocacy for applying that same approach to the other end.
	▲	an hour ago \| parent \| prev [-]
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