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ZeroCool2u 5 hours ago

Regardless of your opinion of Yann or his views on auto regressive models being "sufficient" for what most would describe as AGI or ASI, this is probably a good thing for Europe. We need more well capitalized labs that aren't US or China centric and while I do like Mistral, they just haven't been keeping up on the frontier of model performance and seem like they've sort of pivoted into being integration specialists and consultants for EU corporations. That's fine and they've got to make money, but fully ceding the research front is not a good way to keep the EU competitive.

brandonb 2 hours ago | parent | next [-]

LeCun's technical approach with AMI will likely be based on JEPA, which is also a very different approach than most US-based or Chinese AI labs are taking.

If you're looking to learn about JEPA, LeCun's vision document "A Path Towards Autonomous Machine Intelligence" is long but sketches out a very comprehensive vision of AI research: https://openreview.net/pdf?id=BZ5a1r-kVsf

Training JEPA models within reach, even for startups. For example, we're a 3-person startup who trained a health timeseries JEPA. There are JEPA models for computer vision and (even) for LLMs.

You don't need a $1B seed round to do interesting things here. We need more interesting, orthogonal ideas in AI. So I think it's good we're going to have a heavyweight lab in Europe alongside the US and China.

sanderjd 2 hours ago | parent [-]

Have you published anything about your health time series model? Sounds interesting!

brandonb an hour ago | parent [-]

Sure! Here’s a description: https://www.empirical.health/blog/wearable-foundation-model-...

sanderjd 38 minutes ago | parent [-]

Thanks! This is very neat.

BTW, I went to your website looking for this, but didn't find your blog. I do now see that it's linked in the footer, but I was looking for it in the hamburger menu.

jsnell 2 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

I don't think it's "regardless", your opinion on LeCun being right should be highly correlated to your opinion on whether this is good for Europe.

If you think that LLMs are sufficient and RSI is imminent (<1 year), this is horrible for Europe. It is a distracting boondoggle exactly at the wrong time.

andrepd 2 hours ago | parent | next [-]

It's been 6 months away for 5 years now. In that time we've seen relatively mild incremental changes, not any qualitative ones. It's probably not 6 months away.

mfru 4 minutes ago | parent | next [-]

Reminds me of how cold fusion reactors are only 5 years away for decades now

AStrangeMorrow an hour ago | parent | prev | next [-]

Yeah. I feel like that like many projects the last 20% take 80% of time, and imho we are not in the last 20%

Sure LLMs are getting better and better, and at least for me more and more useful, and more and more correct. Arguably better than humans at many tasks yet terribly lacking behind in some others.

Coding wise, one of the things it does “best”, it still has many issues: For me still some of the biggest issues are still lack of initiative and lack of reliable memory. When I do use it to write code the first manifests for me by often sticking to a suboptimal yet overly complex approach quite often. And lack of memory in that I have to keep reminding it of edge cases (else it often breaks functionality), or to stop reinventing the wheel instead of using functions/classes already implemented in the project.

All that can be mitigated by careful prompting, but no matter the claim about information recall accuracy I still find that even with that information in the prompt it is quite unreliable.

And more generally the simple fact that when you talk to one the only way to “store” these memories is externally (ie not by updating the weights), is kinda like dealing with someone that can’t retain memories and has to keep writing things down to even get a small chance to cope. I get that updating the weights is possible in theory but just not practical, still.

lordmathis 24 minutes ago | parent | prev | next [-]

It's 6 months away the same way coding is apparently "solved" now.

HarHarVeryFunny 4 minutes ago | parent [-]

I think we - in last few months - are very close to, if not already at, the point where "coding" is solved. That doesn't mean that software design or software engineering is solved, but it does mean that a SOTA model like GPT 5.4 or Opus 4.6 has a good chance of being able to code up a working version of whatever you specify, with reason.

What's still missing is the general reasoning ability to plan what to build or how to attack novel problems - how to assess the consequences of deciding to build something a given way, and I doubt that auto-regressively trained LLMs is the way to get there, but there is a huge swathe of apps that are so boilerplate in nature that this isn't the limitation.

I think that LeCun is on the right track to AGI with JEPA - hardly a unique insight, but significant to now have a well funded lab pursuing this approach. Whether they are successful, or timely, will depend if this startup executes as a blue skies research lab, or in more of an urgent engineering mode. I think at this point most of the things needed for AGI are more engineering challenges rather than what I'd consider as research problems.

basket_horse 2 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

But I swear this time is different! Just give me another 6 months!

andrepd 7 minutes ago | parent [-]

And another 6 trillion dollars :^)

next_xibalba an hour ago | parent | prev [-]

> RSI

Wait, we have another acronym to track. Is this the same/different than AGI and/or ASI?

mietek an hour ago | parent | next [-]

Some people should definitely be getting Repetitive Strain Injury from all the hyping up of LLMs.

robrenaud 34 minutes ago | parent | prev | next [-]

Recursive self improvement. It's when AI speeds up the development of the next AI.

9 minutes ago | parent | prev | next [-]
[deleted]
notnullorvoid 36 minutes ago | parent | prev [-]

Recursive Self Improvement

barrell 2 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

While I’d love there to be a European frontier model, I do very much enjoy mistral. For the price and speed it outperforms any other model for my use cases (language learning related formatting, non-code non-research).

Brajeshwar 4 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

There seem to be other news articles mentioning that they are setting up in Singapore as their base. https://www.straitstimes.com/business/ai-godfather-raises-1-...

Signez 4 hours ago | parent | next [-]

Hm, Singapour looks more like "one of their base"; they will have offices in Paris, Montréal, Singapour and New York (according to both this article and the interview Yann Le Cun did this morning on France Inter, the most listened radio in France).

Of course, each relevant newspaper on those areas highlight that it's coming to their place, but it really seems to be distributed.

rubzah an hour ago | parent [-]

All your base are belong to Yann LeCun.

fnands 4 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

Probably just a satellite office.

Might be to be close to some of Yann's collaborators like Xavier Bresson at NUS

4 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]
[deleted]
stingraycharles 4 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

That's a Singaporian newspaper, though; not sure if it's objectively their main base, or just one of them

throwpoaster 3 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

"Show me the incentive and I will show you the outcome."

Almost certainly the IP will be held in Singapore for tax reasons.

re-thc 4 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

> they are setting up in Singapore as their base

Europe in general has been tightening up their rules / taxes / laws around startups / companies especially tech and remote.

It's been less friendly. these days.

Signez 4 hours ago | parent | next [-]

Yann Le Cun litteraly said this morning on the radio in France that it is headquarted in Paris and will pay taxes in France. Go figure…

roromainmain 4 hours ago | parent | next [-]

For such companies, France also offers generous R&D tax credits (Crédit Impôt Recherche): companies can recover roughly 30% of eligible R&D expenses incurred in France as a tax credit, which can eventually be refunded (in cash) if the company has no taxable profit.

storus 3 hours ago | parent [-]

Is that alongside 100% of R&D expenses amortized in taxes when a company has taxable profit covering them?

roromainmain 2 hours ago | parent [-]

Yes indeed, if the company is profitable.

ttoinou 3 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

No he said something like “well yes, only for the parts of profits made in France”

mi_lk 4 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

Doesn’t he live in New York himself? Although not sure if that matters depending on his role

kvgr 4 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

There will be no corporate taxes for a long time, so alls good.

Imustaskforhelp 2 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

This is a singaporean news article from a singporean company[0] (Had to look it up)

As such, They are more likely to talk about singapore news and exaggerate the claims.

Singapore isn't the Key location. From what I am seeing online, France is the major location.

Singapore is just one of the more satellite like offices. They have many offices around the world it seems.

[0]: https://www.sgpbusiness.com/company/Sph-Media-Limited

vessenes an hour ago | parent | prev | next [-]

Partner in a fund that wrote a small check into this — I have no private knowledge of the deal - while I agree that one’s opinion on auto regressive models doesn’t matter, I think the fact of whether or not the auto regressive models work matters a lot, and particularly so in LeCun’s case.

What’s different about investing in this than investing in say a young researcher’s startup, or Ilya’s superintelligence? In both those cases, if a model architecture isn’t working out, I believe they will pivot. In YL’s case, I’m not sure that is true.

In that light, this bet is a bet on YL’s current view of the world. If his view is accurate, this is very good for Europe. If inaccurate, then this is sort of a nothing-burger; company will likely exit for roughly the investment amount - that money would not have gone to smaller European startups anyway - it’s a wash.

FWIW, I don’t think the original complaint about auto-regression “errors exist, errors always multiply under sequential token choice, ergo errors are endemic and this architecture sucks” is intellectually that compelling. Here: “world model errors exist, world model errors will always multiply under sequential token choice, ergo world model errors are endemic and this architecture sucks.” See what I did there?

On the other hand, we have a lot of unused training tokens in videos, I’d like very much to talk to a model with excellent ‘world’ knowledge and frontier textual capabilities, and I hope this goes well. Either way, as you say, Europe needs a frontier model company and this could be it.

giancarlostoro 4 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

I didn't really know who he was, so I went and found his wikipedia, which is written like either he wrote it himself to stroke his ego, or someone who likes him wrote it to stroke his ego:

> He is the Jacob T. Schwartz Professor of Computer Science at the Courant Institute of Mathematical Sciences at New York University. He served as Chief AI Scientist at Meta Platforms before leaving to work on his own startup company.

That entire sentence before the remarks about him service at Meta could have been axed, its weird to me when people compare themselves to someone else who is well known. It's the most Kanye West thing you can do. Mind you the more I read about him, the more I discovered he is in fact egotistical. Good luck having a serious engineering team with someone who is egotistical.

pama 3 hours ago | parent | next [-]

You underestimate academia. Any academic that reads these two sentences only focuses on the first one: He has a named chair at Courant. In Germany, being a a Prof is added to your ID card/passport and becomes part of your official name, like knighthood in other countries.

dr_hooo 44 minutes ago | parent [-]

No true regarding the IDs, only PhD titles can be added. Not job descriptions. Source: academia person in Germany.

timr 3 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

It's not comparing him to anyone. He has an endowed professorship. This is standard in academia, and you give the name because a) it's prestigious for the recipient and b) it strokes the ego of the donor.

leoc 2 hours ago | parent [-]

Right: no-one cares about the Lucasian Chair of Mathematics https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lucasian_Professor_of_Mathemat... because of Henry Lucas, it's the other way around.

lairv 3 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

https://cims.nyu.edu/dynamic/news/1441/

This is just the official name of a chair at NYU. I'm not even sure Jacob T. Schwartz is more well known than Yann LeCun

stephencanon 3 hours ago | parent [-]

Yann is definitely more well-known outside of academia. Inside academia, it's going to depend a lot on your specific background and how old you are.

bobwaycott 3 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-]

That’s not a comparison to another person. That’s his job title. It is not uncommon for universities to have distinguished chairs within departments named after a notable person—in this case, the founder of NYU’s Department of Computer Science.

g947o 3 hours ago | parent | prev [-]

Eh, that paragraph reads perfectly normal to me.

Either you have not read enough Wikipedia pages, or you have too much to complain about. (Or both.)

neversupervised 43 minutes ago | parent | prev [-]

Is it good? This will almost certainly fail. Not because Yann or Europe, but because these sort of hyper-hyped projects fail. SSI and Thinking Machines haven’t lived to the hype.

ma2rten 40 minutes ago | parent [-]

Erm, ... OpenAI has hyped when it started and it took 6 years to take off. It's way to early to declare the SSI and Thinking Machines have failed.

koakuma-chan 10 minutes ago | parent [-]

They took money and haven't released anything. How are they doing?