| ▲ | simmerup 4 hours ago |
| And now realise the same is true for your robot vacuum, car camera, doorbell camera, etc etc We consumers have no protection against big tech |
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| ▲ | boomskats 4 hours ago | parent | next [-] |
| Speak for yourself, I rooted my vacuum the day I bought it |
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| ▲ | pseudocomposer 4 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-] |
| We definitely don’t have any hard boundaries baked into this tech preventing big tech from (ab)using our data this way. But are there specific companies you think are doing this? I think with Meta products, it’s been rather obvious for a long time. But I’ve had a Nest doorbell camera and thermostats for years, and first iRobot and now Roborock vacuums, and they don’t really seem so suspect. |
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| ▲ | autoexec 2 hours ago | parent | next [-] | | You should assume that Google is collecting every scrap of data they can from nest products and that your data will (or could) be handed over to police and the state with or without warrants and with zero notice to you. There were concerns raised with irobot devices selling the floorplans of your home (https://gizmodo.com/roombas-next-big-step-is-selling-maps-of...) and now its owned by China (Picea) so who knows what they're doing. Roborock is also a Chinese company who appears to have been under investigation in Korea for data leaks (https://koreajoongangdaily.joins.com/news/2025-03-05/busines...). At this point I'd consider anything not locally hosted (and certainly anything owned by Google, Amazon, or facebook) to be highly suspect. | | | |
| ▲ | simmerup 2 hours ago | parent | prev [-] | | Amazon literally just put out a superbowl ad of them using their (your?) front door cam feeds to find people. They are all dipping into our data for their ends, Meta is just particularly sloppy/honest about it |
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| ▲ | Semaphor 4 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-] |
| Sure you do. All of those are available in local versions without Internet. Youjust need to care enough, be able to afford them (while my vacuum has no camera, it requires the cloud, but it was significantly cheaper than a local or hackable one), and have the ability to self host something like home assistant. |
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| ▲ | simmerup 2 hours ago | parent | next [-] | | How about we just enforce minimum privacy standards on big tech instead? Sure you can root all your own hardware but you can’t stop the fact that your walk down the street is documented by Amazon and Google front door bells There is no opt out of this surveillance if you live in modern society | | |
| ▲ | whilenot-dev 2 hours ago | parent [-] | | > if you live in modern society Quite an if you got there... pointing security or doorbell cameras to public spaces isn't legal where I live. |
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| ▲ | Gigachad an hour ago | parent | prev [-] | | And what are you doing about everyone elses amazon cameras that are watching you wherever you go, all uploaded to the cloud and processed by AI. |
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| ▲ | _carbyau_ an hour ago | parent | prev | next [-] |
| Obligatory Valetudo reference. Replace the robovac firmware so it doesn't do cloud. https://valetudo.cloud/ Can't help with the rest unfortunately. |
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| ▲ | indubioprorubik 3 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-] |
| At least the vacuum does not try to start a civil war for add impressions.. |
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| ▲ | chaostheory an hour ago | parent | prev | next [-] |
| > We consumers have no protection against big tech I like to call big tech, “Little Sister” since governments are “Big Brother” |
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| ▲ | anonym29 3 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-] |
| >We consumers have no protection against big tech Stop buying it. You are not a robot that is forced to purchase a video doorbell or a robotic vacuum cleaner or a smart thermostat. You have free will. If you do not like a commercially available product, don't buy it, don't use it. It's that simple. |
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| ▲ | autoexec 2 hours ago | parent | next [-] | | > Stop buying it That's my policy, but there's a sucker born every minute and they are buying these products so anytime you are in or near their homes or anywhere a microphone or camera can see you (even one mounted on some idiot's head) you're at risk. Even worse, both people and corporations typically don't disclose their use of those devices when you enter their homes/businesses either. | |
| ▲ | simmerup 2 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-] | | How about we just enforce minimum privacy standards on big tech instead? Sure you can just not buy the thing. But can’t stop the fact that your wall down the street is documented by Amazon and Google front door bells There is no opt out of this surveillance if you live in modern society | |
| ▲ | jasonlotito 3 hours ago | parent | prev [-] | | I think it's a reasonable ask that when buying a product, it has reasonable levels of safety, security, and privacy. Especially with products that might change over time because of software updates. Yes, there are ToS, but it's fine for us as a society to say that consumers deserve more protection against big tech so we aren't a TOS update away from having everything shared or be used for something that wasn't promoted. > You have free will. If you do not like a commercially available product, don't buy it, don't use it. Caveat emptor. But lemon laws exist, too. And, a commercially available product now might not be the same a year from now. | | |
| ▲ | munk-a 3 hours ago | parent | next [-] | | There's compelling reasons for all sorts of home devices to be connected to the internet[1] but the rub is that ToS flexibility and software updates make this a backdoor waiting to happen. I feel like our legal system has significantly failed us by not empowering the consume to say "I accept your device with a wifi antenna for the purposes of updating and I reject any exfiltration of personal data from it to your servers". You can have such a contract written - but this is really a place where something like a consumer advocacy board should step in and make sure those rights and sanely guaranteed. 1. It'd be great to ease the method for updating, it'd be nice to be able to easily monitor the device especially if it could become active in some manner while you're absent (I don't want the stove turning on to broil right after I leave on a three month vacation) | | |
| ▲ | autoexec 2 hours ago | parent [-] | | > I feel like our legal system has significantly failed us by not empowering the consume to say "I accept your device with a wifi antenna for the purposes of updating and I reject any exfiltration of personal data from it to your servers". Worse it's allowed for them to remote into your device and disable features that you bought the device to use, by paywalling them off behind a subscription service that didn't exist when you brought the product home or just them entirely. To me that's no different than theft. It doesn't matter if it's amazon logging into you kindle overnight and removing books you already paid for from your virtual bookshelf, or Sony pushing an update to remove the option to use linux on your PS3, or BMW deciding that you should have to pay them every month just to use the heated seats option you already paid for when you bought your car. If I, as an individual, sold you something than broke into your house to steal it or break it or demand ransom to get parts back that would be a crime, but companies get away with it somehow. What Google, Facebook, and Amazon do are basically just stalking. |
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| ▲ | anonym29 3 hours ago | parent | prev [-] | | Just to clarify, I don't mean what I said in a manner hostile to consumers, I mean what I said in a manner hostile to abusive corporations. Let them either adapt to market demand for better products (which we demonstrate by not continuing to buy their current garbage), or let them (the corporations) starve and die if they refuse to. Stop feeding the parasites. |
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| ▲ | scubadude 2 hours ago | parent | prev | next [-] |
| Don't buy the shit. You don't need a smart doorbell or robot vacuum at a minimum. |
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| ▲ | SoftTalker 4 hours ago | parent | prev [-] |
| Don't use it. |
